Good Vs. Evil
Tuesday, March 4, 2003 by joetheblow | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
Who wins? Why? Is it really winning if the outcome is already settled?
More on this later.
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IPlural
Reply #142 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 1:06 PM
Jafo, looking at it put that way, yep yep!
everyone has something...
Reply #142 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 1:06 PM
Jafo, looking at it put that way, yep yep!everyone has something...
Bangkokboy
Reply #143 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 1:24 PM
Reply #143 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 1:24 PM
didn't know paxx was one of them biblical scholars. 
Ta hak wa karrm bpen taa chan dtong mi chohk rai dtalawt wela
if karma is real, my life should be an endless misery stream. Actually, it seems to be getting better and better every year.
Ta hak wa karrm bpen taa chan dtong mi chohk rai dtalawt wela
if karma is real, my life should be an endless misery stream. Actually, it seems to be getting better and better every year.
Doreen
Reply #145 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 7:38 PM
Reply #145 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 7:38 PM
They both were "Ignorant & Innocent" to the fact that they were naked but once they ate the apple they opened their eyes and seen things they never noticed before that were now available to turn into evillll...
(which is where Love & Porn gets mixed up now)
guess that's where they get that ignorance is Bliss saying cuz the more stuff you know the more evil you can be if you let yourself, in this world you "need" to wear blinders and not learn or look too much around cuz there is more evil than good I think and it's better to stay ignorant and innocent. (Stupid Apples!)
(which is where Love & Porn gets mixed up now)
guess that's where they get that ignorance is Bliss saying cuz the more stuff you know the more evil you can be if you let yourself, in this world you "need" to wear blinders and not learn or look too much around cuz there is more evil than good I think and it's better to stay ignorant and innocent. (Stupid Apples!)
Bangkokboy
Reply #146 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 7:44 PM
Reply #146 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 7:44 PM
didn't know Doreen was one of them biblical scholars. hehe 
Doreen
Reply #147 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:02 PM
Reply #147 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:02 PM
I think most ppl use the Bible like a magic 8 ball to find answers... hehe
but you need to be under the Holy spirit's guidence to understand what God is trying to teach or say to you when you read it (which means don't even try to read it w/ tunes blasting in the background) hehe
that book will never die cuz it's words are alive and breathing forever and they speak to each ones heart differently so they can be understood by that person even though the underline meaning or teaching is always the same, I think that is what is so special about the Bible how the "words" printed in it speak to all kinds of diff ppl from all kinds of walks of life and touches them, no other book can do that.
but you need to be under the Holy spirit's guidence to understand what God is trying to teach or say to you when you read it (which means don't even try to read it w/ tunes blasting in the background) hehe
that book will never die cuz it's words are alive and breathing forever and they speak to each ones heart differently so they can be understood by that person even though the underline meaning or teaching is always the same, I think that is what is so special about the Bible how the "words" printed in it speak to all kinds of diff ppl from all kinds of walks of life and touches them, no other book can do that.
Doreen
Reply #148 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:03 PM
Reply #148 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:03 PM
and I've only read alil of it myself I play wayyyy too much music to read. hehe
but I do own a Bible like most other ppl do
but I do own a Bible like most other ppl do
Doreen
Reply #149 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:07 PM
Reply #149 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:07 PM
okay lemme try a better way to put that "those words" (the words that are in the Bible) are words of truth and truth never changes so they stand the test of time... there I think that is what I meant I struggle w/ words all the time... hehe!
paxx
Reply #150 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:11 PM
Reply #150 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:11 PM
Weird for a guy who doesn't believe in God, but I actually read the Bible 2 or 3 times from one cover to the other.
Doreen
Reply #151 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:13 PM
Reply #151 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:13 PM
hehe Paxxy and that's cuz you're always searching for the truth and somehow you know it's there too...
I know it's all there but I really really hate reading so God has to speak to me other ways but I'm always blasting my tunes so he does not get to far w/ me... hehe
I know it's all there but I really really hate reading so God has to speak to me other ways but I'm always blasting my tunes so he does not get to far w/ me... hehe
paxx
Reply #152 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:18 PM
Reply #152 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:18 PM
Well, Doreen, not really. I actually do think it's a great book.
Doreen
Reply #153 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:46 PM
Reply #153 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 8:46 PM
welll you must! you read it 2-3 X's! I have not read it through even once! hehe
(maybe someday I will)
(maybe someday I will)
White_Moth
Reply #154 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:23 PM
Reply #154 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:23 PM
Adam and Eve were like children today, innocent "of" evil, as they had yet to recognize that evil as well as good exists. They were seperated by each through choice made very clear. But they chose to disobey a simple command through temptation, cunning and deceit. When they discovered this after the fact, then they were no longer innocent and began upon the road to choosing whom or what they will serve, being banished from the only place where they could have lived free and innocent.
Just as children today who become no longer innocent, means becoming responsible for their own actions and choices. All we as parents and adults can do is to see that they remain on a straighter path in this world and be there to guide them when they veer off that path. For us to neglect this responsibility, will only lead to the childs destruction which we will be held responsible for, while allowing evil another foothold in this world.
We have available the power to ensure that evil never gains the upper hand though it exists. If it does gain the upper hand, then we have only ourselves to blame and not GOD, for not using that power, freely available to us.
Just as children today who become no longer innocent, means becoming responsible for their own actions and choices. All we as parents and adults can do is to see that they remain on a straighter path in this world and be there to guide them when they veer off that path. For us to neglect this responsibility, will only lead to the childs destruction which we will be held responsible for, while allowing evil another foothold in this world.
We have available the power to ensure that evil never gains the upper hand though it exists. If it does gain the upper hand, then we have only ourselves to blame and not GOD, for not using that power, freely available to us.
IPlural
Reply #155 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:35 PM
Reply #155 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:35 PM
dang, done typed and deleted 6 times now....
-=[ MUM'S the WORD ]=-
-=[ MUM'S the WORD ]=-
Angel_Wings
Reply #156 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:36 PM
Reply #156 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:36 PM
I find it 'ironic' that the forbidden fruit was knowledge...how 'convenient' (she says in "Church Lady" voice). He-he
I think faith is a very good and important thing to the human spirit...but to not ever feel safe to question it...to not 'delve' further is blindness but to have no faith is without sight just as much so...
Angel_Wings grew up with a very religious "holy-roller" Christian mother...it did her absolutely NO good...
If someone uses religion as a 'front' to mask their own demons and take advantage of children (especially the poor and the meek ones) then that is truly evil... There are many belief systems...and many can use those beliefs as a means to do/believe good or do/believe evil... It's all how it's used and interpreted in the end.
Angel_Wings thinks Ben & Jerry's Ice Cream is the most evil of all! Especially when it shows up on her thighs! Okay, THAT and Red Robin's Steak Fries! Oh salvation from fast food...where art thou?! He-he!
I think faith is a very good and important thing to the human spirit...but to not ever feel safe to question it...to not 'delve' further is blindness but to have no faith is without sight just as much so...
Angel_Wings grew up with a very religious "holy-roller" Christian mother...it did her absolutely NO good...
If someone uses religion as a 'front' to mask their own demons and take advantage of children (especially the poor and the meek ones) then that is truly evil... There are many belief systems...and many can use those beliefs as a means to do/believe good or do/believe evil... It's all how it's used and interpreted in the end.
Angel_Wings thinks Ben & Jerry's Ice Cream is the most evil of all! Especially when it shows up on her thighs! Okay, THAT and Red Robin's Steak Fries! Oh salvation from fast food...where art thou?! He-he!
IPlural
Reply #157 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:47 PM
Reply #157 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:47 PM
religion is subjective and the bible is a creation of huamns, men at that... and also subjective tool used to keep women as second class citizens, children as chattle and men in power...
Honor thy mother and father, sure if they earn it...
Thou shalt not kill, but what he really meant was Thou shalt not Murder? rather presumptious don't you think?
faith is good, belief is also... religion is the opiate of the masses and the helms man of the vote and pocket book. Also a neat and simple manner in which to make sure women stay in thier place...
anyway...
ok mum isn't the word for those moments, but enough of it from me...
on to good and evil, don't need no bible or god for reasoning that... its a human condition without the need of crutches...
Honor thy mother and father, sure if they earn it...
Thou shalt not kill, but what he really meant was Thou shalt not Murder? rather presumptious don't you think?
faith is good, belief is also... religion is the opiate of the masses and the helms man of the vote and pocket book. Also a neat and simple manner in which to make sure women stay in thier place...
anyway...
ok mum isn't the word for those moments, but enough of it from me...
on to good and evil, don't need no bible or god for reasoning that... its a human condition without the need of crutches...
joetheblow
Reply #158 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:47 PM
Reply #158 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 9:47 PM
#138 by Developer joetheblow - 3/12/2003 10:26:06 AM
"With the Hitler (and others more or less) situation, what I was saying is that the people who followed them felt they where 'right' or they were on the good side. They weren't saying, "Hey lets join him and spread evil all across the land."
Let me clarify... while I might think guys like him and there acts are extremely bad, I am not saying that I can say without a shadow of a doubt that I am right (I am not a judge or jury on all things in the Universe). It is my belief that I am right.
I could point to many facts as to why I feel I am right; why their actions were bad and opposing action is good, but nevertheless, in the end does it mean it truly was Evil?
The people who followed Hitler most likely felt they were right. They most likely felt that they were destroying the forces of "Evil" by doing there actions in the camps and racist views. I am sure that they were not thinking, "Hey lets join him and spread evil all across the land." They could point to many facts as well is they want and still feel they are just as right as I am.
But this is where it gets dirty... if they won and continued that way of life (killing, murder, suppression, racism), in the end would they have been defeated by someone else to change the way of life on Earth or would that type of society self destruct?
I believe that Hitler's way of seeing things would ultimately ended in self destruction (either of that society or of the Earth's human population)
Freedom and rights for all individuals seems the way to go when it comes to a society. Is it Good? I think so, BUT that doesn't mean it can not end in the same result. It would just take longer with more of a chance for the human race to possibly live to be enlightened even further.
"With the Hitler (and others more or less) situation, what I was saying is that the people who followed them felt they where 'right' or they were on the good side. They weren't saying, "Hey lets join him and spread evil all across the land."
Let me clarify... while I might think guys like him and there acts are extremely bad, I am not saying that I can say without a shadow of a doubt that I am right (I am not a judge or jury on all things in the Universe). It is my belief that I am right.
I could point to many facts as to why I feel I am right; why their actions were bad and opposing action is good, but nevertheless, in the end does it mean it truly was Evil?
The people who followed Hitler most likely felt they were right. They most likely felt that they were destroying the forces of "Evil" by doing there actions in the camps and racist views. I am sure that they were not thinking, "Hey lets join him and spread evil all across the land." They could point to many facts as well is they want and still feel they are just as right as I am.
But this is where it gets dirty... if they won and continued that way of life (killing, murder, suppression, racism), in the end would they have been defeated by someone else to change the way of life on Earth or would that type of society self destruct?
I believe that Hitler's way of seeing things would ultimately ended in self destruction (either of that society or of the Earth's human population)
Freedom and rights for all individuals seems the way to go when it comes to a society. Is it Good? I think so, BUT that doesn't mean it can not end in the same result. It would just take longer with more of a chance for the human race to possibly live to be enlightened even further.
IPlural
Reply #159 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 10:06 PM
Reply #159 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 10:06 PM
Hitler was actually a Hero of WWI and was given the equivliant of the Medal of Honor...
Durring a barrage with gas and High Explosive's, something like 50 men blinded and hardly able to breath, he also almost totally blind, formed them up into a line hand to shoulder and he led those men, each and everyone of them, out of that barrage and down deserted roads until they found medical treatment a town away while in the hospital recovering three officers who had paid for their commision came in and tried to get him to join their revolt against the leaders of germany. They were number one, Jewish and number two part of the communist party of all things, that is where is hatered of both peoples came about from. It festered over a long period of time and personal failures while attempting to become an artist.
He would go to the art school every so often and present his new work for consideration only to be told he wasn't good enough, and yet he was also always pointed in the direction of someone who would purchase even his work for something so he could have money for food and a place to flop. Well the art dealers tended to also be jewish, so even more hate built upon what he already held and on it went until he found himself in the brown shirts... wild huh?
His father was a minor civil servant and when he died provided his mother and siblings a small retirement check which they lived off of, Hitler used to do odd jobs and such to offset the lack of money and also supply himself with paper and pencils when he could. Even then as a young teen he dreamed of being an artist...
I've the two book bio on Hitler by a jewish author, who really did a fantastic job because he did not let personal emotion get in his way of recovering as much of the truth of Hitlers life and presenting it without coloring it, so people could learn to see what makes a Hitler and a leader of a NAZI party...
Even he started out with nobel ideals and christianity as his faith...
It's not so simple really, he was many things even though he died a evil occult worshiping zelot and beyond wackybobo...
Durring a barrage with gas and High Explosive's, something like 50 men blinded and hardly able to breath, he also almost totally blind, formed them up into a line hand to shoulder and he led those men, each and everyone of them, out of that barrage and down deserted roads until they found medical treatment a town away while in the hospital recovering three officers who had paid for their commision came in and tried to get him to join their revolt against the leaders of germany. They were number one, Jewish and number two part of the communist party of all things, that is where is hatered of both peoples came about from. It festered over a long period of time and personal failures while attempting to become an artist.
He would go to the art school every so often and present his new work for consideration only to be told he wasn't good enough, and yet he was also always pointed in the direction of someone who would purchase even his work for something so he could have money for food and a place to flop. Well the art dealers tended to also be jewish, so even more hate built upon what he already held and on it went until he found himself in the brown shirts... wild huh?
His father was a minor civil servant and when he died provided his mother and siblings a small retirement check which they lived off of, Hitler used to do odd jobs and such to offset the lack of money and also supply himself with paper and pencils when he could. Even then as a young teen he dreamed of being an artist...
I've the two book bio on Hitler by a jewish author, who really did a fantastic job because he did not let personal emotion get in his way of recovering as much of the truth of Hitlers life and presenting it without coloring it, so people could learn to see what makes a Hitler and a leader of a NAZI party...
Even he started out with nobel ideals and christianity as his faith...
It's not so simple really, he was many things even though he died a evil occult worshiping zelot and beyond wackybobo...
joetheblow
Reply #160 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 10:12 PM
Reply #160 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 10:12 PM
I think we read into the Adam and Eve thing o much. I think the idea was to say that the aquired knowledge and because of that they became aware of the many options and thoughts that were available to them. Knowledge of all those things (whatever those things are) is not guided wisdom. Also they did not understand thier newly aquired knowledge either.
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Yes, the bible was written by humans. I am not sure why people think it was not. I believe (I could be wrong) that in the text it says that. John, Luke, Paul... all there stories.
Now the question should actually be is if God is an artist and She makes a painting, isn't that painting a piece of Him? Wouldn't you say there way a control factor in most (not all unless She wanted too) of how the painting looked?
Windowblinds changes the way your GUI looks; millions of combonations and styles... is it not still Windows?
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Yes, the bible was written by humans. I am not sure why people think it was not. I believe (I could be wrong) that in the text it says that. John, Luke, Paul... all there stories.
Now the question should actually be is if God is an artist and She makes a painting, isn't that painting a piece of Him? Wouldn't you say there way a control factor in most (not all unless She wanted too) of how the painting looked?
Windowblinds changes the way your GUI looks; millions of combonations and styles... is it not still Windows?
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Reply #141 Wednesday, March 12, 2003 11:58 AM
Isn't it funny? Cause I really don't consider nudity as Evil, nor do I think most people do nowadays. It may be "improper" to walk naked in the street, but certainly not Evil. Seeing a naked person in the street would probably cause a ot of giggles more than anything.