the fall of customize?
Wednesday, April 24, 2002 by John Hamp | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
When I first discovered winamp skins I went to a site called customize.org. Then I went to skinz when cust dissapeared. But since cust has come back its become a haven for l33ts. What's the deal there? Whose in charge of the zoo there? Its just wallpapers and screenshots and they constantly attack Stardock's stuff. I read on deskmod the wb3 announcement and the cust admins were on attacking it there. Then on cust itself they attack it some more. What kind of skin site has admins that bad mouth new releases of the software they support on their site?
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Frogboy
Reply #102 Sunday, April 28, 2002 5:55 PM
Reply #102 Sunday, April 28, 2002 5:55 PM
Watching return of the jedi right now (wireless laptop).
Jark, interesting poll. Demographics have a lot to do with things too. For instance, WB doesn't skin nearly as much as msstyles in the free version. So for people who aren't willing to pay for skinnining, msstyles is the way to go.
Over time, msstyles will have a lot more users (just as plain old themes on Windows 95 had a lot more users than skins).
But that's a different topic entirely.
Jark, interesting poll. Demographics have a lot to do with things too. For instance, WB doesn't skin nearly as much as msstyles in the free version. So for people who aren't willing to pay for skinnining, msstyles is the way to go.
Over time, msstyles will have a lot more users (just as plain old themes on Windows 95 had a lot more users than skins).
But that's a different topic entirely.
Jafo
Reply #103 Sunday, April 28, 2002 8:37 PM
Reply #103 Sunday, April 28, 2002 8:37 PM
Doreen...'perspective'....
Remember, too, that the word 'Doreenosis' was coined as a term of affection, not derision....
And I miss China.....[lots].....;(
Remember, too, that the word 'Doreenosis' was coined as a term of affection, not derision....
And I miss China.....[lots].....;(
darwn23
Reply #104 Monday, April 29, 2002 12:22 AM
Reply #104 Monday, April 29, 2002 12:22 AM
I agree entirely with robohead when he said that you guys are hypocrits, the same thing that custo is/was doing, you guys are doing here also. An entire thread dedicated to bashing custo and its teenage admins. Its a shame, I mean look at the scenario here, you guys being more mature and all with more knowledge should know better than to argue with kids as you call them, but yet still you guys go back and forth about it.
What makes you think your cause is better than thiers, what makes you think that your opinions and your feelings on this matter are the only ones that have been hurt, this all stems from software and who chooses to use what. Just get over it and let people use what they want to use and thats that. If you know your software is not what I/they say it is then dont let that make you look like an ass with constant bickering, and name calling in threads such as this. And Oh for those that did not see how the whole thing. It was from this post that I made :WindowBlinds 3.3 released
by FrogBoy on 04/23/02 @ 12:41 EDT (General News)
WindowBilnds is a program designed to make Windows into a fully skinnable operating system. It does this by applying visual styles (skins) to Windows. On Windows XP, it extends Microsoft's visual style engine to support WB visual styles which are faster and use less memory and are far more flexible. With version 3.3, much of the Windows XP visual style engine has been brought to Windows 98, ME, and 2000. New under the hood changes include a global bitmap cache which dramatically improves performance while reducing memory consumption. Stardock also worked closely with ATI and Nvidia to take advantage of some of the new hardware accelerated APIs (the results can be seen in the latest drivers from both). Creating skins with WindowBlinds can be as easy as loading up notepad and a paint program. Users can also download SkinStudio (www.skinstudio.net) which provides a graphical environment for creating skins.
Useful links:
Full skinning guide:
http://www.windowblinds.net/skinning
Getting Started:
https://www.stardock.com/products/windowblinds/wb3/wb3_guide_final.htm
Download:
http://www.windowblinds.net/default.asp?page=download
Screenshot:
http://www.windowblinds.net/wb-may02.jpg
Want your desktop to look like that screenshot? Grab https://www.wincustomize.com/skins.asp?cmd=456&SkinID
Related Links:
Download WindowBlinds 3.3
Screenshot
Getting Started
News Comments
Posted by: maximillian (*.tampabay.rr.com) 04/23/02 21:24:02
im sure its a great program for others.. but it just does'nt work as well on my computer as does Styles XP.. it is a great product though..
:: What's worse, Ignorance or Apathy? I Don't know and I don't care! ::
maximillian
What makes you think your cause is better than thiers, what makes you think that your opinions and your feelings on this matter are the only ones that have been hurt, this all stems from software and who chooses to use what. Just get over it and let people use what they want to use and thats that. If you know your software is not what I/they say it is then dont let that make you look like an ass with constant bickering, and name calling in threads such as this. And Oh for those that did not see how the whole thing. It was from this post that I made :WindowBlinds 3.3 released
by FrogBoy on 04/23/02 @ 12:41 EDT (General News)
WindowBilnds is a program designed to make Windows into a fully skinnable operating system. It does this by applying visual styles (skins) to Windows. On Windows XP, it extends Microsoft's visual style engine to support WB visual styles which are faster and use less memory and are far more flexible. With version 3.3, much of the Windows XP visual style engine has been brought to Windows 98, ME, and 2000. New under the hood changes include a global bitmap cache which dramatically improves performance while reducing memory consumption. Stardock also worked closely with ATI and Nvidia to take advantage of some of the new hardware accelerated APIs (the results can be seen in the latest drivers from both). Creating skins with WindowBlinds can be as easy as loading up notepad and a paint program. Users can also download SkinStudio (www.skinstudio.net) which provides a graphical environment for creating skins.
Useful links:
Full skinning guide:
http://www.windowblinds.net/skinning
Getting Started:
https://www.stardock.com/products/windowblinds/wb3/wb3_guide_final.htm
Download:
http://www.windowblinds.net/default.asp?page=download
Screenshot:
http://www.windowblinds.net/wb-may02.jpg
Want your desktop to look like that screenshot? Grab https://www.wincustomize.com/skins.asp?cmd=456&SkinID
Related Links:
Download WindowBlinds 3.3
Screenshot
Getting Started
News Comments
Posted by: maximillian (*.tampabay.rr.com) 04/23/02 21:24:02
im sure its a great program for others.. but it just does'nt work as well on my computer as does Styles XP.. it is a great product though..
:: What's worse, Ignorance or Apathy? I Don't know and I don't care! ::
maximillian
DavidK
Reply #105 Monday, April 29, 2002 12:53 AM
Reply #105 Monday, April 29, 2002 12:53 AM
oh stop it, let this thread go away. It's over at custo so don't come here and start it again. Plus, you left out the slam that was added by an admin at custo to the news post as well as the next several comments. But it doesn't matter, let it go away....
darwn23
Reply #107 Monday, April 29, 2002 5:39 AM
Reply #107 Monday, April 29, 2002 5:39 AM
too high and mighty to admit wrong doing also on your part eh.. i see that now
darwn23
Reply #108 Monday, April 29, 2002 5:43 AM
Reply #108 Monday, April 29, 2002 5:43 AM
yup same old story, its easy to keep the thread going before someone points out this site and its users two sided ways
craeonics
Reply #109 Monday, April 29, 2002 6:05 AM
Reply #109 Monday, April 29, 2002 6:05 AM
Hmm, thread rolled off the front page. Ah well, so much for that stuff. Let me tie up some loose ends:
1. Robohead has a point (and not because he mentions me)
2. Regarding that skinz.org thing, I was to blame for what Doreen was flamed for back in the days, I just ran into it when it was at post 10000 or so. And I did back up her up, even though like 99% of people their were against her (and probably some of those names are here today)
3. Now you know why long texts are bad, compact = to the point
4. Same old story, yes, but we will see it return again and again
5. Curious how when customize returned the dominant group consisted of people who I'd never ever seen on other skin sites. This just proves that there is no global cross site "community", but only in-site cliques. And cliques tend to not think, but only react. This thread and the one at customize demonstrates that.
6. Doh!
7. <macro> people take things way too seriously </macro>
1. Robohead has a point (and not because he mentions me)
2. Regarding that skinz.org thing, I was to blame for what Doreen was flamed for back in the days, I just ran into it when it was at post 10000 or so. And I did back up her up, even though like 99% of people their were against her (and probably some of those names are here today)
3. Now you know why long texts are bad, compact = to the point
4. Same old story, yes, but we will see it return again and again
5. Curious how when customize returned the dominant group consisted of people who I'd never ever seen on other skin sites. This just proves that there is no global cross site "community", but only in-site cliques. And cliques tend to not think, but only react. This thread and the one at customize demonstrates that.
6. Doh!
7. <macro> people take things way too seriously </macro>
Frogboy
Reply #110 Monday, April 29, 2002 12:05 PM
Reply #110 Monday, April 29, 2002 12:05 PM
More equivalence is the easy path. It is always easy for someone to sound noble and objective by simply saying "both sides are wrong". Robohead says he doesn't come here often because the high and mighty attitude here, yet he still posts as Skinz.org, admin'd by shoggot, the king of high and mighty attitudes.
At the end of the day it comes down to this:
Software developers should NOT expect to have their software critizied and their companies flamed by ADMINS on a NEWS ITEM on a skin site. Anyone who disagrees with that will just have to agree to disagree then because there's no way to warp that simple basic tenet of society any other way.
It just adds insult to injury that it is somehow my fault that the admins went on to create a poll insulting our software and a message board thread full of personal attacks.
So you'll have to forgive me if I don't take the easy way out and say "Oh yes, both sides are equally wrong..."
At the end of the day it comes down to this:
Software developers should NOT expect to have their software critizied and their companies flamed by ADMINS on a NEWS ITEM on a skin site. Anyone who disagrees with that will just have to agree to disagree then because there's no way to warp that simple basic tenet of society any other way.
It just adds insult to injury that it is somehow my fault that the admins went on to create a poll insulting our software and a message board thread full of personal attacks.
So you'll have to forgive me if I don't take the easy way out and say "Oh yes, both sides are equally wrong..."
Doreen
Reply #111 Monday, April 29, 2002 12:09 PM
Reply #111 Monday, April 29, 2002 12:09 PM
I think you "should" expect it... after all Admins are merely ppl nothing more
(I'm in a debating mood)
okay that is just my opinion actually hehe
(I'm in a debating mood)
okay that is just my opinion actually hehe
JayG
Reply #112 Monday, April 29, 2002 2:52 PM
Reply #112 Monday, April 29, 2002 2:52 PM
not on sites that hope to thrive. how many skin authors are gonna post skins to a site where the admins are going to ridicule their submission? thats the beauty of the free market. lots of choices. lots of people have said they aren't gonna go there. i know i don't. if i want to read kiddies flaming each other there are lots of better sites i could go to do that.
Doreen
Reply #113 Monday, April 29, 2002 3:37 PM
Reply #113 Monday, April 29, 2002 3:37 PM
point is they prob will still thrive... they just have their own flavor that's all
if it's not your favorite flavor don't eat it! hehe
as I said I don't post there (I only read on occasion) and I do like to have the variety of that, but that does not necessarily mean I eat it, I'm very picky...
well maybe Brad should just not have his news posted there if it continues to be an issue and that site continues to attack him? me myself I would "still submit" the news there and just maybe not go back and read it? cuz there is other ppl there that will want to read it and benefit from it you cannot judge the whole site cuz of some remarks posted
lots of lurkers you knowwww
if it's not your favorite flavor don't eat it! hehe
as I said I don't post there (I only read on occasion) and I do like to have the variety of that, but that does not necessarily mean I eat it, I'm very picky...
well maybe Brad should just not have his news posted there if it continues to be an issue and that site continues to attack him? me myself I would "still submit" the news there and just maybe not go back and read it? cuz there is other ppl there that will want to read it and benefit from it you cannot judge the whole site cuz of some remarks posted
lots of lurkers you knowwww
Firestorm
Reply #114 Monday, April 29, 2002 3:45 PM
Reply #114 Monday, April 29, 2002 3:45 PM
Wow, I go away for a few days and all hell breaks loose 
How can we have a 100-reply thread just to arrive at the same conclusion we've known all along: Custo's admins are killing the site with their attitude.
How can we have a 100-reply thread just to arrive at the same conclusion we've known all along: Custo's admins are killing the site with their attitude.
darwn23
Reply #115 Monday, April 29, 2002 3:56 PM
Reply #115 Monday, April 29, 2002 3:56 PM
Wow out of all the people here doreen and a few others understand what freedom of choice and freedom of opinion means. Have you ever heard the phrase "opinions are like assholes, everyone has one"? and ummm
Frogboy :Software developers should NOT expect to have their software critizied and their companies flamed by ADMINS on a NEWS ITEM on a skin site.
last time i checked your software is shareware right? and what are the terms of shareware.. try before you buy.. if you dont like it then chuck it and tell others why you dont like it. and see if you have things in common.. apparently the people who dont have problems with it like it and thats why they side with you, and thats good, you guys have your own little support group going on here
Frogboy :Software developers should NOT expect to have their software critizied and their companies flamed by ADMINS on a NEWS ITEM on a skin site.
last time i checked your software is shareware right? and what are the terms of shareware.. try before you buy.. if you dont like it then chuck it and tell others why you dont like it. and see if you have things in common.. apparently the people who dont have problems with it like it and thats why they side with you, and thats good, you guys have your own little support group going on here
DavidK
Reply #116 Monday, April 29, 2002 4:03 PM
Reply #116 Monday, April 29, 2002 4:03 PM
The issue is real simple on most sites. If you post a comment or start a thread where you say you hate someone, or just try to start a fight, the thread gets locked or deleted. Simple.
This is a skinning site, they are a skinning site, there is no place for personal attacks or proclaiming your hatred of another member of the community. If you have a problem with someone you deal with it in email. Do it here on this message board with a statement that is intended to hurt someone else or get a flame war going against an individual and you'll see it deleted. Do it again and you'll probably get exiled. An admin does it - they'll get fired.
It's simple....
Skinning sites are for skinning software's enhancements (skins) to get posted to be shared with other people. The sites exist for skinners (who put an incredible amount of work into what they do for free) to share their work with people who want to customize their computer's look and feel. Don't try to mess with that simple function of this community on its most basic level.
Skinning is fun... let's keep it that way...
This is a skinning site, they are a skinning site, there is no place for personal attacks or proclaiming your hatred of another member of the community. If you have a problem with someone you deal with it in email. Do it here on this message board with a statement that is intended to hurt someone else or get a flame war going against an individual and you'll see it deleted. Do it again and you'll probably get exiled. An admin does it - they'll get fired.
It's simple....
Skinning sites are for skinning software's enhancements (skins) to get posted to be shared with other people. The sites exist for skinners (who put an incredible amount of work into what they do for free) to share their work with people who want to customize their computer's look and feel. Don't try to mess with that simple function of this community on its most basic level.
Skinning is fun... let's keep it that way...
DavidK
Reply #117 Monday, April 29, 2002 4:14 PM
Reply #117 Monday, April 29, 2002 4:14 PM
btw - this argument ended a long time ago at custo. Pod and darksheer and waybling have agreed that there is no place for personal attacks and personal hatred on their site. They said it's wrong and it won't happen again. They agreed it's all about skinning and skinning should be the focus of the site. rkenshin said what he did was wrong (miriku has not said anything like that but that's not surprising). The CEO thread was deleted which was meant as a peace offering.
Basically this should have never happened. It's over and we can learn from this that sometimes people do stupid things, say stupid things. It would be kinder to the people involved to let it go and see what the future brings.
Basically this should have never happened. It's over and we can learn from this that sometimes people do stupid things, say stupid things. It would be kinder to the people involved to let it go and see what the future brings.
darwn23
Reply #118 Monday, April 29, 2002 4:23 PM
Reply #118 Monday, April 29, 2002 4:23 PM
But see those are "your" rules, "your" own doctrine.. ways that "you" live by, i dont see it "your" way. "I" am an individual that means i dont go with the crowd "I" make up "my" own mind and do "my" own thing. Thats what being in america is about. Last I checked this site was not run by a dictator, who tells people how to act or fit in.
darwn23
Reply #119 Monday, April 29, 2002 4:25 PM
Reply #119 Monday, April 29, 2002 4:25 PM
so why is'nt this thread deleted.. and why are you still carrying it on?.. hell why are you even talking to me, you are much more mature and knowledgeable you should know better right?
Doreen
Reply #120 Monday, April 29, 2002 4:46 PM
Reply #120 Monday, April 29, 2002 4:46 PM
That's good David I did not know that had happened... "hopefully" treetog and the other might reconsider uploading their stuff again to Custo who knows but there is more to the sites then what you read there is the ppl that never hit the msg boards or read a single word, they just view skins and download and enjoy what is suppose to be fun right?
If ppl want to really see Custo survive instead of go down the drain as they say, maybe it would be better not to suggest to remove your skins but to upload more and keep trying to get the site to take a better shape?
not always a wise thing to do when someone says F*** you and go away to just leave unless of course you want to, but then maybe you never really like the site as much as you said you did? hehe
If ppl want to really see Custo survive instead of go down the drain as they say, maybe it would be better not to suggest to remove your skins but to upload more and keep trying to get the site to take a better shape?
not always a wise thing to do when someone says F*** you and go away to just leave unless of course you want to, but then maybe you never really like the site as much as you said you did? hehe
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Reply #101 Sunday, April 28, 2002 5:45 PM
http://www.deviantart.com/poll.php?pollID=76
it is interesting to note that we only ran this for a couple days and therefore that is why it did not garner the normal number of results that we get. nonetheless it is an interesting look into people's thoughts regarding the two.