the fall of customize?
Wednesday, April 24, 2002 by John Hamp | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
When I first discovered winamp skins I went to a site called customize.org. Then I went to skinz when cust dissapeared. But since cust has come back its become a haven for l33ts. What's the deal there? Whose in charge of the zoo there? Its just wallpapers and screenshots and they constantly attack Stardock's stuff. I read on deskmod the wb3 announcement and the cust admins were on attacking it there. Then on cust itself they attack it some more. What kind of skin site has admins that bad mouth new releases of the software they support on their site?
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craeonics
Reply #42 Friday, April 26, 2002 3:45 AM
Reply #42 Friday, April 26, 2002 3:45 AM
craeonics can't say anything anymore, 'cos Jafo nicked the bottom line
grayhaze
Reply #43 Friday, April 26, 2002 7:11 AM
Reply #43 Friday, April 26, 2002 7:11 AM
For anyone who's wondering what that link was that I posted, it was a pretty good example of the attitudes of the admins over at Custo. It was a whole forum thread consisting of personal attacks on Brad and Stardock by one of the admins. Strangely, it seems to have been removed now... 
As an aside, have you heard the news about ThemeXP.org losing their whole database of MSStyles for use with StyleXP? Now that's got to sting...
As an aside, have you heard the news about ThemeXP.org losing their whole database of MSStyles for use with StyleXP? Now that's got to sting...
Jafo
Reply #44 Friday, April 26, 2002 7:55 AM
Reply #44 Friday, April 26, 2002 7:55 AM
Oh heck, Crae.....here's a line for you then...
--------------------------------------------------------
Use that one...
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Use that one...
Frogboy
Reply #46 Friday, April 26, 2002 10:54 AM
Reply #46 Friday, April 26, 2002 10:54 AM
It was about how administrators can torpedo their own sites by alienating the people who make sites successful.
And by success I mean the common usage of the word success as opposed to the warm fuzzy usage where success can be re-defined as being anything. (Maybe the homeless guy is a success because he WANTS to be homeless! )
And by success I mean the common usage of the word success as opposed to the warm fuzzy usage where success can be re-defined as being anything. (Maybe the homeless guy is a success because he WANTS to be homeless!
)
paxx
Reply #48 Friday, April 26, 2002 12:01 PM
Reply #48 Friday, April 26, 2002 12:01 PM
Hum... I on't think teenagers behavior can be excused per say, but it can be understood. Eveybody's been a teen before.
Most teen have extreme opinions and extreme values. Teens like to have a "cause" to fight for. Of course, they are rude, that's because they feel very strongly about their "cause".
I had a cause to when I was a kid, and I even went to jail for it.
Custo admins' "cause" is freeware and fight against commercial ware.
That does not make them evil. They believe in what they believe and fight for it. They are still kids and don't understand the concept of "moderation" and "diplomacy" yet. But they will grow up, as we all did.
I am not a rebelous teenager anymore, so I have no interest in the site. So I just don't go there anymore. But I understand what growing up is. If you don't want to be part of it, just don't go on their site.
Most teen have extreme opinions and extreme values. Teens like to have a "cause" to fight for. Of course, they are rude, that's because they feel very strongly about their "cause".
I had a cause to when I was a kid, and I even went to jail for it.
Custo admins' "cause" is freeware and fight against commercial ware.
That does not make them evil. They believe in what they believe and fight for it. They are still kids and don't understand the concept of "moderation" and "diplomacy" yet. But they will grow up, as we all did.
I am not a rebelous teenager anymore, so I have no interest in the site. So I just don't go there anymore. But I understand what growing up is. If you don't want to be part of it, just don't go on their site.
Frogboy
Reply #49 Friday, April 26, 2002 12:39 PM
Reply #49 Friday, April 26, 2002 12:39 PM
Paxx - Style XP is commercialware. I don't see them fighting against freeware. I just see them being jerks.
If they dislike WindowBlinds or whatever, then they don't have to post news about it. But it's extremely tacky for them to rip on news items of software programs that have sections on their site.
Maybe they should take off all the commercial ware on their site if they feel that way (which I don't think they feel that way or they wouldn't be boosting one commercial product over another). Of course, if they did that, the traffic would get even lower.
If they dislike WindowBlinds or whatever, then they don't have to post news about it. But it's extremely tacky for them to rip on news items of software programs that have sections on their site.
Maybe they should take off all the commercial ware on their site if they feel that way (which I don't think they feel that way or they wouldn't be boosting one commercial product over another). Of course, if they did that, the traffic would get even lower.
AJCrowley
Reply #51 Friday, April 26, 2002 1:33 PM
Reply #51 Friday, April 26, 2002 1:33 PM
I heard Brad's got a mean right hook. I reckon we should settle this the old fashioned way, and put all the custo admins in a ring with Brad, and a chainsaw.
AJC
AJC
Frogboy
Reply #52 Friday, April 26, 2002 1:42 PM
Reply #52 Friday, April 26, 2002 1:42 PM
Every once in awhile I get someone who is shocked to learn that I don't act "professional".
My handle is "Frogboy" for crying out loud. If I had to act professional all the time I'd become some Fortune 100 developer or something and make the big bucks. Being able to run around as "Frogboy" and debate this kind of stuff is one of the handful of perks of being at a small company that makes desktop perosnalization software.
My handle is "Frogboy" for crying out loud. If I had to act professional all the time I'd become some Fortune 100 developer or something and make the big bucks. Being able to run around as "Frogboy" and debate this kind of stuff is one of the handful of perks of being at a small company that makes desktop perosnalization software.
JavaBrain
Reply #53 Friday, April 26, 2002 2:21 PM
Reply #53 Friday, April 26, 2002 2:21 PM
Yeah, how professional can a guy that's called "Frogboy" be, anyway? He probably smells like cheese, too.....
paxx
Reply #54 Friday, April 26, 2002 2:42 PM
Reply #54 Friday, April 26, 2002 2:42 PM
Bleh, I still think these are kids who are still growning up, trying to adopt a "noble cause" to build something solid and serious at the same time. Thus they provide the news, cause they have to since it concerns part of the community, then they criticize it. Or bash on it. Or whatever. Teens are mixed up, but of course, don't go telling them that. *grin* They are quite happy being Don Quichote, although every adult think he was a psycho.
Brad, the best you can do is delete the site from your bookmarks and never go back. I never ever go there anymore. I don't even consider it as part the the community for real.
If an 8 year old started his own kiddie skins web site, it may be a lpace that would interest other kids his age, but it wouldn't be one of my favorite for sure. A teen skins site is hardly better AFAIC.
Brad, the best you can do is delete the site from your bookmarks and never go back. I never ever go there anymore. I don't even consider it as part the the community for real.
If an 8 year old started his own kiddie skins web site, it may be a lpace that would interest other kids his age, but it wouldn't be one of my favorite for sure. A teen skins site is hardly better AFAIC.
migellito
Reply #55 Friday, April 26, 2002 3:09 PM
Reply #55 Friday, April 26, 2002 3:09 PM
paxx.. in some ways i see just what you're talking about. it's like when i was 27 and these two 19 yr. old friends got an apt. together for college. i was over one day, and they had just gotten back from this huge shopping trip to rig out their place. i was already grinning and shaking my head as i imagined their reaction to their bills a few weeks down the road. then, as i sat down before their new 25 in. tv, they informed me "we went in on the tv together - half and half!" (smiles all around.) i just grinned and shook my head some more. of course, when one of them moved out months later there was a huge fight over the tv..
my point is, with a lot of stuff they do you really do just have to shake your head and grin, knowing they must learn the hard lessons on their own. however, there are some things which are just beyond that.
if someone was printing up flyers and passing them around malls and sticking them in windshields all over town that said "mike's a crackhead," i'd do more than just shake my head at the wacky teenage hijinks. i'd try to have it stopped. and i bet pretty much any lawyer would be more than happy to help me.
i'm not sure what actually constitutes libel, especially on the net, but there are lines that can get crossed.
my point is, with a lot of stuff they do you really do just have to shake your head and grin, knowing they must learn the hard lessons on their own. however, there are some things which are just beyond that.
if someone was printing up flyers and passing them around malls and sticking them in windshields all over town that said "mike's a crackhead," i'd do more than just shake my head at the wacky teenage hijinks. i'd try to have it stopped. and i bet pretty much any lawyer would be more than happy to help me.
i'm not sure what actually constitutes libel, especially on the net, but there are lines that can get crossed.
GreenReaper
Reply #56 Friday, April 26, 2002 3:10 PM
Reply #56 Friday, April 26, 2002 3:10 PM
*notes that WinCustomize is effectively Brad's bookmark page*
davad70
Reply #57 Friday, April 26, 2002 3:27 PM
Reply #57 Friday, April 26, 2002 3:27 PM
The debate once again goes back to what is acceptable behavior to who. rkenshen's behavior would probably be more acceptable to me if in fact he was a teenager. however, he's 21 years old. Obviously, acceptable behavior for a 21 will differ depending on each person's life experience. In my mind, this kind of stuff would be ok for a 15 or 16 year old...I had a cause at that age also. But at 21, I was married and had 2 kids, therefore I see things from a different point of view, when it comes to how a 21 year od should act.
DavidK
Reply #58 Friday, April 26, 2002 4:40 PM
Reply #58 Friday, April 26, 2002 4:40 PM
The fact is whether they are 10 years old or 40 it doesn't excuse a skinning site admin attacking skinnning software on any skinning site. Their actions are flat out inexcusable and wrong. It appears they love the controversy, the arguments and name calling. They must think it makes them cool somehow, probably in some whiteboy hip/rap I'm so bad sort of way. hehe what a couple of losers... they want you to use stylesxp which isn't skinning software, doesn't do anything, limits you to using MS's evil XP, adds nothing to windows and forces you to have a Luna looking system. Give me a break... that's why everyone thinks they're teenagers.
Ignore them and ignore their site. The more controversy that they generate (which is why they went off their own site to get attention) the more traffic they get. It's pathetic that when they notice their own site is being ignored they go to deskmod to start a fight hoping it will bring users to their own site. I say ban 'em as the trolls they are.
Ignore them and ignore their site. The more controversy that they generate (which is why they went off their own site to get attention) the more traffic they get. It's pathetic that when they notice their own site is being ignored they go to deskmod to start a fight hoping it will bring users to their own site. I say ban 'em as the trolls they are.
paxx
Reply #59 Friday, April 26, 2002 4:42 PM
Reply #59 Friday, April 26, 2002 4:42 PM
Hum... I thought they were like 17-19...
Most of their traffic is though. I had a friend who was a kindergarden teacher, and oh boy... she drove me nuts! Hehehe! She had that juvenile attitude all the time, with everybody, as if we were all her "little friends".
Most of their traffic is though. I had a friend who was a kindergarden teacher, and oh boy... she drove me nuts! Hehehe! She had that juvenile attitude all the time, with everybody, as if we were all her "little friends".
Frogboy
Reply #60 Friday, April 26, 2002 6:01 PM
Reply #60 Friday, April 26, 2002 6:01 PM
Customize.org was the first customization site I went to (before skinz.org even). So I have a soft spot for the site itself.
So it's hard seeing it being ruined as it has.
For me, the issue isn't whether they like WindowBlinds or not. Lots of people even more ignorant than them flame it all the time for all sorts of reasons both legitimate and silly. The issue is administrators of a skin site that have a WindowBlinds section actively going around trashing it.
They are lucky I"m not "professional" or we'd never had Customize.org in the GUI Olympics. It doesn't statistically qualify as a major skin site anymore (VelocityART gets more new skin submissions than Custo) but just like skinz.org, there's that nostalgia value. They could turn it all around if they'd just get admins that treated people decently.
Whoever owns the site doesn't have to bring in these guys to be admins.
So it's hard seeing it being ruined as it has.
For me, the issue isn't whether they like WindowBlinds or not. Lots of people even more ignorant than them flame it all the time for all sorts of reasons both legitimate and silly. The issue is administrators of a skin site that have a WindowBlinds section actively going around trashing it.
They are lucky I"m not "professional" or we'd never had Customize.org in the GUI Olympics. It doesn't statistically qualify as a major skin site anymore (VelocityART gets more new skin submissions than Custo) but just like skinz.org, there's that nostalgia value. They could turn it all around if they'd just get admins that treated people decently.
Whoever owns the site doesn't have to bring in these guys to be admins.
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Reply #41 Thursday, April 25, 2002 11:12 PM
Boy, if I bashed LiteSTEP for fragging my computer every other day I'd be hoarse...
As with WB in the beginning, LS was a real pain in the arse...with all sorts of unexpected 'fun' occurring just to keep you on your toes.
But Customizing, whether it be with a cute see-through box of water-cooled madness, or by skinning and shelling the mediocrity out of your OS...was all about 'experimentation', and we were great guys for testing the bugs out of new and wonderful 'skinnable' poggies, eager to get 'one over' on the other skinners by being first to try something new.
Who cared if it fell over like a one-legged alcoholic in a hurricane?
It was 'fun and different' and that's the bottom line...