Getting into 3D skinning
Do you think it's coming?
Tuesday, March 20, 2007 by Frogboy | Discussion: Skinning
Programs like Adobe Photoshop, Illustrator, Corel, Paintshop Pro are pretty standard tools for most skinners.
But how many skinners are experts with programs like Maya and 3D Studio?
I ask this because one can imagine a day not so far in the future when skinning involves working with 3D Models.
In Windows Vista, Microsoft nearly had the Sidebar support DWM gadgets out of the box which used XAML and could be exported from 3D Studio as models. Imagine a true 3D object on your desktop for instance.
With Windows DreamScene and Stardock DeskScapes, for animated wallpaper, you can already see the demand for 3D rendered scenes (as opposed to just video files).
Do many, or even most, skinners who know 2D graphics design packages also have a familiarity with 3D modeling?
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NightwingDragon
Reply #42 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:10 PM
Reply #42 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:10 PM
Well, in defense to xino, I also agree. Modeling is a very complicated operation. Unlike 2D, 3D uses all 3 axis therefore all axis of the model must be represented. Like i mentioned before tho in my honest opinion Mapping is the most difficult process taken on in the process of modeling. With 2d, you apply the desired design, effecs, image, whatever, and you're done. with 3D, modeling is just the beginning to a long process of swearing and pulling your hair from it's roots..lol. I will never take anything away from skinning, or it's complexity, I'm mearly mentioning that it's two completely different processes, and should be treated as such to achieve the desired effect of melding them together.
Also keep in mind that even a 3D image is still only 2D if and when the object is rendered and applied to 2D purposes. 3D is only 3D while it's in the application it is suited for, which is a 3D app.
Also what Xino had mentioned about overlapping in photoshop is called map texturing. In order to successfully texture a model with any map you must first edit the model's geometry in waht's known as a UV mapping program. The use of this type of program allows you to import a 3D model into 2D purposes. The mesh is "flattened" according to how you want the mesh to be projected. You also have the ability to unwrap the model into several pieces depending on how the model is grouped, or identified. By disecting the model into material assignments you will have complete control of how you want to texture the model, and it's individual components.
Then you would save the reconfigured geometry, (which is also the object), and it's new UV map. By doing this you would be able to properly texture the model in any 2D app and save the texture as a jpg. The reason mapping is done is so that the model's geometry and textures both line up. If done incorrectly you would see massive distortion on the textures, and even parts of the texture's background color on the model.
It seems very obvious Xino knows exactly what he's talking about on this one...lol.
PS Xino if you ever wanna trade notes bro lemme know, I have 3DS max8, rhino3D and several others, maybe you can show me some pointers so my nose stops bleeding, and ya never know, even a seasoned vet could use some help from an intermediate like me
Also keep in mind that even a 3D image is still only 2D if and when the object is rendered and applied to 2D purposes. 3D is only 3D while it's in the application it is suited for, which is a 3D app.
Also what Xino had mentioned about overlapping in photoshop is called map texturing. In order to successfully texture a model with any map you must first edit the model's geometry in waht's known as a UV mapping program. The use of this type of program allows you to import a 3D model into 2D purposes. The mesh is "flattened" according to how you want the mesh to be projected. You also have the ability to unwrap the model into several pieces depending on how the model is grouped, or identified. By disecting the model into material assignments you will have complete control of how you want to texture the model, and it's individual components.
Then you would save the reconfigured geometry, (which is also the object), and it's new UV map. By doing this you would be able to properly texture the model in any 2D app and save the texture as a jpg. The reason mapping is done is so that the model's geometry and textures both line up. If done incorrectly you would see massive distortion on the textures, and even parts of the texture's background color on the model.
It seems very obvious Xino knows exactly what he's talking about on this one...lol.
PS Xino if you ever wanna trade notes bro lemme know, I have 3DS max8, rhino3D and several others, maybe you can show me some pointers so my nose stops bleeding, and ya never know, even a seasoned vet could use some help from an intermediate like me
NightwingDragon
Reply #43 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:13 PM
Reply #43 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:13 PM
lol i'm stayin outa that one VStyler is maaaaad...lol. *zips lips and sits in corner*
vStyler
Reply #44 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:16 PM
Reply #44 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:16 PM
Lifes too short to be mad. Just stating my case is all. Debate is healthy. 
-xino
Reply #45 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:45 PM
I never said you had no experience but your assuming that just because i havent yet produced a 3d looking WB that I cant, how do you know what my 3D background is, How do you know that I havent learned splines, nurb modelling, deformations, extrude?? I have been learning and experimenting in 3DSMax for years also, you think your the only one that can use a 3D app? Perhaps I choose not to brag about it as though I wrote the book. Honestly your work doesn't lend itself to 13+ years experience.
So please don't assume that because I disagree with you that I doubt your knowledge and accordingly don't of me and don't put words in my mouth I never said you didnt know what you were talking about. Put simply, get your facts straight eh?
Don't tell me to crawl before I can walk when you frankly have NO idea WHAT I am capable of.
Your statements are your opinions and thats all. All I have to go on as far as your talent is what you have contributed to the site by way of WB's and I left you a comment on your most recent skin stating what I thought of your work based on your 13 years experience. Perhaps you should learn to crawl also in PS and SKS.
I don't have to prove why or why not I think 3D can be a benefit in WB, Hate to break it to ya but just because u have an opinion.. dont make it right. 13 years or not.
Lastly, no one likes a know-it-all that disregards other peoples endeavours because they cant accomplish what another tries to
You wanna drag it out some more..be my guest.
Pretty much everything you said is egotistical and I'm not sure why you responded the way you did.
First off, don't attack my skills (or lack thereof in your opinion) just because I gave my opinion. I never once attacked you in any way. You're starting to sound alot like TSF, which I'm sure you will agree is an egotistical prick at times. You've had your own run-ins with him. Keep the personal insults out of this. Common courtesy please?
FYI, I have one a small handful of skins for the public. Most of the skins I've made are for friends and family. Just because I'm not publicly proficient doesn't mean anything. It just means I keep most of my stuff private because I don't want to release it for whatever reason.
We can disagree but be cordial about it. It is possible you know?
Just because I haven't uploaded alot of things here doesn't mean that skinning is all that I do. I personally have been working alot in the last year which stopped all of my skinbuilding. I've made alot of websites over the years, alot of digital artwork, and pages upon pages of traditional artwork which has never been published outside of a learning environment. my true passion is in animation. I skin because I hate the default user interfaces.
I never once said you can't do anything. In fact you're the one who stated you're trying to learn 3d so you can use it in your skinning skillset. I'm only going by what you stated, not me.
Also, I never said I'm an expert and I've never meant to come across as condescending. Like I said before please re-read my posts without a cynical eye. I may be blunt, but that doesn't make anything I said less true. In fact I stated that already, but you seem to want to argue for whatever reason.
I'm giving someone else (not you) the reasons why 3d skinning has no benefit in Windowblinds skinning, at least at the present moment. That's all my posts were about. I have no idea why you try to keep getting into a type fight on a forum for some reason.
Also the skin you posted on was based on a winamp skin and a LS theme. I didn't make most of the design choices. Other creative people did. But to base that skin on the ones I already mentioned, design choices were made for me.
Now if you would like to argue or discuss anything after this post, please e-mail me. it's in my profile. Who knows maybe we can learn from each other. But these little rants from both of us are getting this post offtopic. SOrry 'bout that gang.
Now back to the 3d in skinning topic.
I just wish some of the "professional" skinners out there would use 3d programs more in icon creation. When I see a great skin, but terrible perspective on icons, I will always refuse to pay for the skin and support the skinners, no matter who they are. A little time is all it takes from making your icons lackluster into stunning pieces of iconography. When I see something for sale, especially skins, I expect there to be alot of professionalism in it. I f I personally can make a better looking icon, why would I pay for one that I think is inferior?
Reply #45 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:45 PM
I never said you had no experience but your assuming that just because i havent yet produced a 3d looking WB that I cant, how do you know what my 3D background is, How do you know that I havent learned splines, nurb modelling, deformations, extrude?? I have been learning and experimenting in 3DSMax for years also, you think your the only one that can use a 3D app? Perhaps I choose not to brag about it as though I wrote the book. Honestly your work doesn't lend itself to 13+ years experience.
So please don't assume that because I disagree with you that I doubt your knowledge and accordingly don't of me and don't put words in my mouth I never said you didnt know what you were talking about. Put simply, get your facts straight eh?
Don't tell me to crawl before I can walk when you frankly have NO idea WHAT I am capable of.
Your statements are your opinions and thats all. All I have to go on as far as your talent is what you have contributed to the site by way of WB's and I left you a comment on your most recent skin stating what I thought of your work based on your 13 years experience. Perhaps you should learn to crawl also in PS and SKS.
I don't have to prove why or why not I think 3D can be a benefit in WB, Hate to break it to ya but just because u have an opinion.. dont make it right. 13 years or not.
Lastly, no one likes a know-it-all that disregards other peoples endeavours because they cant accomplish what another tries to
You wanna drag it out some more..be my guest.
Pretty much everything you said is egotistical and I'm not sure why you responded the way you did.
First off, don't attack my skills (or lack thereof in your opinion) just because I gave my opinion. I never once attacked you in any way. You're starting to sound alot like TSF, which I'm sure you will agree is an egotistical prick at times. You've had your own run-ins with him. Keep the personal insults out of this. Common courtesy please?
FYI, I have one a small handful of skins for the public. Most of the skins I've made are for friends and family. Just because I'm not publicly proficient doesn't mean anything. It just means I keep most of my stuff private because I don't want to release it for whatever reason.
We can disagree but be cordial about it. It is possible you know?
Just because I haven't uploaded alot of things here doesn't mean that skinning is all that I do. I personally have been working alot in the last year which stopped all of my skinbuilding. I've made alot of websites over the years, alot of digital artwork, and pages upon pages of traditional artwork which has never been published outside of a learning environment. my true passion is in animation. I skin because I hate the default user interfaces.
I never once said you can't do anything. In fact you're the one who stated you're trying to learn 3d so you can use it in your skinning skillset. I'm only going by what you stated, not me.
Also, I never said I'm an expert and I've never meant to come across as condescending. Like I said before please re-read my posts without a cynical eye. I may be blunt, but that doesn't make anything I said less true. In fact I stated that already, but you seem to want to argue for whatever reason.
I'm giving someone else (not you) the reasons why 3d skinning has no benefit in Windowblinds skinning, at least at the present moment. That's all my posts were about. I have no idea why you try to keep getting into a type fight on a forum for some reason.
Also the skin you posted on was based on a winamp skin and a LS theme. I didn't make most of the design choices. Other creative people did. But to base that skin on the ones I already mentioned, design choices were made for me.
Now if you would like to argue or discuss anything after this post, please e-mail me. it's in my profile. Who knows maybe we can learn from each other. But these little rants from both of us are getting this post offtopic. SOrry 'bout that gang.
Now back to the 3d in skinning topic.
I just wish some of the "professional" skinners out there would use 3d programs more in icon creation. When I see a great skin, but terrible perspective on icons, I will always refuse to pay for the skin and support the skinners, no matter who they are. A little time is all it takes from making your icons lackluster into stunning pieces of iconography. When I see something for sale, especially skins, I expect there to be alot of professionalism in it. I f I personally can make a better looking icon, why would I pay for one that I think is inferior?
vStyler
Reply #46 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:51 PM
My comments on your skin were nothing to do with design, IT was good. The execution..was not.
Cordial? Common Courtesy? Cmon dude.. get a grip.
Im done with ya.. get ur last word ( you know you have to).. and move on.
Reply #46 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:51 PM
Also the skin you posted on was based on a winamp skin and a LS theme. I didn't make most of the design choices. Other creative people did. But to base that skin on the ones I already mentioned, design choices were made for me.
My comments on your skin were nothing to do with design, IT was good. The execution..was not.
please don't try and be some johnny-come-lately
you must crawl before you can walk.
Learn the tools you have before you try and overstep your own skills.
I never once attacked you in any way.
Cordial? Common Courtesy? Cmon dude.. get a grip.
Im done with ya.. get ur last word ( you know you have to).. and move on.
-xino
Reply #47 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:54 PM
Well, in defense to xino, I also agree. Modeling is a very complicated operation. Unlike 2D, 3D uses all 3 axis therefore all axis of the model must be represented. Like i mentioned before tho in my honest opinion Mapping is the most difficult process taken on in the process of modeling. With 2d, you apply the desired design, effecs, image, whatever, and you're done. with 3D, modeling is just the beginning to a long process of swearing and pulling your hair from it's roots..lol. I will never take anything away from skinning, or it's complexity, I'm mearly mentioning that it's two completely different processes, and should be treated as such to achieve the desired effect of melding them together.
Also keep in mind that even a 3D image is still only 2D if and when the object is rendered and applied to 2D purposes. 3D is only 3D while it's in the application it is suited for, which is a 3D app.
Also what Xino had mentioned about overlapping in photoshop is called map texturing. In order to successfully texture a model with any map you must first edit the model's geometry in waht's known as a UV mapping program. The use of this type of program allows you to import a 3D model into 2D purposes. The mesh is "flattened" according to how you want the mesh to be projected. You also have the ability to unwrap the model into several pieces depending on how the model is grouped, or identified. By disecting the model into material assignments you will have complete control of how you want to texture the model, and it's individual components.
Then you would save the reconfigured geometry, (which is also the object), and it's new UV map. By doing this you would be able to properly texture the model in any 2D app and save the texture as a jpg. The reason mapping is done is so that the model's geometry and textures both line up. If done incorrectly you would see massive distortion on the textures, and even parts of the texture's background color on the model.
It seems very obvious Xino knows exactly what he's talking about on this one...lol.
PS Xino if you ever wanna trade notes bro lemme know, I have 3DS max8, rhino3D and several others, maybe you can show me some pointers so my nose stops bleeding, and ya never know, even a seasoned vet could use some help from an intermediate like me
Actually texture mapping is an extremely arduous step. I mostly just used to click buttons until I found something I liked.
I'm not that good at modelling and I know it. I never found it was my storongest ability, so I focused on other things, like animation.
A description on how I did what I did in my previews:
For the single icon in the grizzlefish preview I posted, I did no texture mapping in 3d Max. I created the box and did all the extruding and such. Then I rendered out a targa w/ alpha and opened that in PS. From there I just used selection masks and gradients to get the proper lighting on the computer tower icon. Then I added in the glows and the other various small effects.
I find it's much easier to render a flat (not lighted) object than going through the hassle of setting up tons of lights to get the desired effect in any 3d program.
For the huge play button at the top, All that is is a capsule shaped like an aspirin. I then created a simple pyramid (triangle) and extruded that shape from the capsule. I did that so I would get the angles/perspective right in PS, so I wouldn't have to guess and get a silly looking end product. I then added the gloss effect with gradients and selection sets again to get the desired effect. The indention around the button was also added in PS with a simple layer style. The glows and such are also blurs and simple layer styles. After you add one after another, I finally came up with what I was looking for exactly.
Those are the ways I use 3d in my skins
Reply #47 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:54 PM
Well, in defense to xino, I also agree. Modeling is a very complicated operation. Unlike 2D, 3D uses all 3 axis therefore all axis of the model must be represented. Like i mentioned before tho in my honest opinion Mapping is the most difficult process taken on in the process of modeling. With 2d, you apply the desired design, effecs, image, whatever, and you're done. with 3D, modeling is just the beginning to a long process of swearing and pulling your hair from it's roots..lol. I will never take anything away from skinning, or it's complexity, I'm mearly mentioning that it's two completely different processes, and should be treated as such to achieve the desired effect of melding them together.
Also keep in mind that even a 3D image is still only 2D if and when the object is rendered and applied to 2D purposes. 3D is only 3D while it's in the application it is suited for, which is a 3D app.
Also what Xino had mentioned about overlapping in photoshop is called map texturing. In order to successfully texture a model with any map you must first edit the model's geometry in waht's known as a UV mapping program. The use of this type of program allows you to import a 3D model into 2D purposes. The mesh is "flattened" according to how you want the mesh to be projected. You also have the ability to unwrap the model into several pieces depending on how the model is grouped, or identified. By disecting the model into material assignments you will have complete control of how you want to texture the model, and it's individual components.
Then you would save the reconfigured geometry, (which is also the object), and it's new UV map. By doing this you would be able to properly texture the model in any 2D app and save the texture as a jpg. The reason mapping is done is so that the model's geometry and textures both line up. If done incorrectly you would see massive distortion on the textures, and even parts of the texture's background color on the model.
It seems very obvious Xino knows exactly what he's talking about on this one...lol.
PS Xino if you ever wanna trade notes bro lemme know, I have 3DS max8, rhino3D and several others, maybe you can show me some pointers so my nose stops bleeding, and ya never know, even a seasoned vet could use some help from an intermediate like me
Actually texture mapping is an extremely arduous step. I mostly just used to click buttons until I found something I liked.
I'm not that good at modelling and I know it. I never found it was my storongest ability, so I focused on other things, like animation.
A description on how I did what I did in my previews:
For the single icon in the grizzlefish preview I posted, I did no texture mapping in 3d Max. I created the box and did all the extruding and such. Then I rendered out a targa w/ alpha and opened that in PS. From there I just used selection masks and gradients to get the proper lighting on the computer tower icon. Then I added in the glows and the other various small effects.
I find it's much easier to render a flat (not lighted) object than going through the hassle of setting up tons of lights to get the desired effect in any 3d program.
For the huge play button at the top, All that is is a capsule shaped like an aspirin. I then created a simple pyramid (triangle) and extruded that shape from the capsule. I did that so I would get the angles/perspective right in PS, so I wouldn't have to guess and get a silly looking end product. I then added the gloss effect with gradients and selection sets again to get the desired effect. The indention around the button was also added in PS with a simple layer style. The glows and such are also blurs and simple layer styles. After you add one after another, I finally came up with what I was looking for exactly.
Those are the ways I use 3d in my skins
-xino
Reply #48 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:58 PM
My comments on your skin were nothing to do with design, IT was good. The execution..was not.
Cordial? Common Courtesy? Cmon dude.. get a grip.
Im done with ya.. get ur last word ( you know you have to).. and move on.
Actually you took my comments out of context. When I said "you" I was speaking as a general "you" to anyone who could be reading this post. I apologize for any misunderstanding on that behalf.
Also design has a direct reflection on the execution. The font choices and such were not mine. I took no creative liberties with the skin at all and I closely adhered to what the others created before me. That's the last I'll say on the subject.
Now back to the 3d topic at hand, I hope.
Reply #48 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:58 PM
Also the skin you posted on was based on a winamp skin and a LS theme. I didn't make most of the design choices. Other creative people did. But to base that skin on the ones I already mentioned, design choices were made for me.
My comments on your skin were nothing to do with design, IT was good. The execution..was not.
please don't try and be some johnny-come-lately
you must crawl before you can walk.
Learn the tools you have before you try and overstep your own skills.
I never once attacked you in any way.
Cordial? Common Courtesy? Cmon dude.. get a grip.
Im done with ya.. get ur last word ( you know you have to).. and move on.
Actually you took my comments out of context. When I said "you" I was speaking as a general "you" to anyone who could be reading this post. I apologize for any misunderstanding on that behalf.
Also design has a direct reflection on the execution. The font choices and such were not mine. I took no creative liberties with the skin at all and I closely adhered to what the others created before me. That's the last I'll say on the subject.
Now back to the 3d topic at hand, I hope.
Jafo
Reply #49 Thursday, March 22, 2007 12:52 AM
Reply #49 Thursday, March 22, 2007 12:52 AM
Probably a case of 'you' being the collective [general] pronoun getting people all defensive through mis-interpretation.
Let's get back to nurbs, mip-mapping, et al ....
vStyler
Reply #50 Thursday, March 22, 2007 1:12 AM
Reply #50 Thursday, March 22, 2007 1:12 AM
There was no mis-interpretation I wasn't born yesterday.
cycoced
Reply #51 Thursday, March 22, 2007 2:36 AM
Reply #51 Thursday, March 22, 2007 2:36 AM
NightWingDragron, polygons!!!!
I couldn't remember the word in English, hence I used another word being a small surface, I came with triangle...
Funny thing is, Polygon is Polygone in French, I should have dropped the "e", for crying out loud, now I look like a dumb a**...
I couldn't remember the word in English, hence I used another word being a small surface, I came with triangle...
Funny thing is, Polygon is Polygone in French, I should have dropped the "e", for crying out loud, now I look like a dumb a**...
NightwingDragon
Reply #52 Thursday, March 22, 2007 3:33 AM
Reply #52 Thursday, March 22, 2007 3:33 AM
lmao, yea I do that too. always happens the most when the description is the most critical too...lol. Polygon, and box modeling is a nightmare for me. I learned using NURBS modeling and stuck with it. I have several other modeling apps but Rhino seems to work the best for me due to my learning curve....LOL. I use UV Mapper to do all my mapping, and Cinema4D for rendering. I want to learn max, but I open it, stare at all the shiny pretty icons like a goof, then my nose starts bleeding, and I close it and open rhino...LMAO. Another really awesome app is DeepPaint3D. It allows you to paint directly onto the model. Only prob is if you want the textures to look right ya still gotta map it. Kind of a sweet sorrow deal...lol. If you ever wanna swap notes lemme know, I'll be more than happy to share my knowledge if you are. take care man.
take care man.
cycoced
Reply #53 Monday, March 26, 2007 10:07 AM
Reply #53 Monday, March 26, 2007 10:07 AM
NightwingDragon,
My 3D Modeling knowledge is purely theoretical (I know the maths behind the magic, and that's it). I just can't be bothered with the huge learning curve required by these types of application to get correct results.
Thank you for your sharing knowledge proposal anyway, this is nice!
Take care, and keep on skinning!
My 3D Modeling knowledge is purely theoretical (I know the maths behind the magic, and that's it). I just can't be bothered with the huge learning curve required by these types of application to get correct results.
Thank you for your sharing knowledge proposal anyway, this is nice!
Take care, and keep on skinning!
NightwingDragon
Reply #54 Tuesday, March 27, 2007 10:45 AM
Reply #54 Tuesday, March 27, 2007 10:45 AM
Hey No prob Cycoced, I figured i'd put up the offer. I'm the opposite, I understand why and how it does what it does, but none of the technical aspects of it...lol. The real mystery is how i manage to get it all to work!...lol. Well, I better get at it, I'm tryin to get some high end weapons packs prepared for distribution. I'm trying to get some of my work sold thru Daz3D, and maybe afew other places . Take care man.
. Take care man.
GH33DA
Reply #55 Thursday, April 5, 2007 12:01 AM
Reply #55 Thursday, April 5, 2007 12:01 AM
Hey Brad!
I know this thread is old, but, since I had been using 3ds max for my icons ans wallpapers, I completely agree with the fact that skinning will be entering the 3rd dimension and sooner that most people think. Especially since Aero is setup the way it is. And with tools like Expressions Blend, the possibilities of this happening are very good.
I know this thread is old, but, since I had been using 3ds max for my icons ans wallpapers, I completely agree with the fact that skinning will be entering the 3rd dimension and sooner that most people think. Especially since Aero is setup the way it is. And with tools like Expressions Blend, the possibilities of this happening are very good.
IRaidedTheFridge
Reply #56 Thursday, April 5, 2007 12:34 AM
Reply #56 Thursday, April 5, 2007 12:34 AM
If someone could do it, I think a 3D skin could be neat! I tend to stick with photoshop. It can make some pretty three dimensional things if you know how to use it right! I made this media skin all in photoshop, but it looks pretty 3d.
GH33DA
Reply #57 Thursday, April 5, 2007 12:50 AM
Reply #57 Thursday, April 5, 2007 12:50 AM
I think the biggest hurdle for me going from 2d to 3d was lighting. Getting used to the fact that just because I painted the object a certain shade of blue, it may not show up that same shade of blue in the render. Learning about lighting and rendering is half the battle. I'm still learning it.
I think one of the main advantages will be taking your typical desktop controls and giving them dimension. Being able to turn the control in 3 space and giving it a whole new set of functionality would be a big step in UI.
I think one of the main advantages will be taking your typical desktop controls and giving them dimension. Being able to turn the control in 3 space and giving it a whole new set of functionality would be a big step in UI.
IRaidedTheFridge
Reply #59 Thursday, April 5, 2007 11:32 AM
Reply #59 Thursday, April 5, 2007 11:32 AM
Thanks Brainiac! So it's actually been quite awhile since I've played with a three dimensional graphics program... what's everybody using these days? Seems like Bryce is popular.
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Reply #41 Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:06 PM
So please don't assume that because I disagree with you that I doubt your knowledge and accordingly don't of me and don't put words in my mouth I never said you didnt know what you were talking about. Put simply, get your facts straight eh?
Don't tell me to crawl before I can walk when you frankly have NO idea WHAT I am capable of.
Your statements are your opinions and thats all. All I have to go on as far as your talent is what you have contributed to the site by way of WB's and I left you a comment on your most recent skin stating what I thought of your work based on your 13 years experience. Perhaps you should learn to crawl also in PS and SKS.
I don't have to prove why or why not I think 3D can be a benefit in WB, Hate to break it to ya but just because u have an opinion.. dont make it right. 13 years or not.
Lastly, no one likes a know-it-all that disregards other peoples endeavours because they cant accomplish what another tries to
You wanna drag it out some more..be my guest.