HotList
Wednesday, April 30, 2003 by MadIce | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
The lists of skinners with top downloads rarely changes. The list attracts attention to skinners that already have a lot of attention. Because the current system is very prominent new skinners may not have the attention they deserve. I would like to see a list of downloads from skinners that are new. Not sure how to do that, but limiting the list to new skinners with not more than 3 skins/suites may produce interesting results. Let's call it the HotList.
We should keep the old lists of course, but maybe we should give the HotList extra attention. One can easily do that by locating the list above the Top Downloads list.
The Featured Skin often focuses on popular skins or noteworthy skins. It would be great to have it foces on new talent or have a second category called HotSkin. Maybe located next to the traditional Featured Skin section. Seems like there is room for that on the page.
Maybe you have different or better ideas. What do you think about the subject?
We should keep the old lists of course, but maybe we should give the HotList extra attention. One can easily do that by locating the list above the Top Downloads list.
The Featured Skin often focuses on popular skins or noteworthy skins. It would be great to have it foces on new talent or have a second category called HotSkin. Maybe located next to the traditional Featured Skin section. Seems like there is room for that on the page.
Maybe you have different or better ideas. What do you think about the subject?
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WOM
Reply #22 Friday, May 2, 2003 3:14 PM
Reply #22 Friday, May 2, 2003 3:14 PM
That was the newbie jitters. Once you uploaded a few walls you calmed down didn't you Lady Akasha? And you became accepted in no time. Now people want to be like you. 
GhoS
Reply #24 Friday, May 2, 2003 4:01 PM
Reply #24 Friday, May 2, 2003 4:01 PM
I know for me I never look at the list for Top Authors, as mentioned it rarely changes. Its nice to recognize authors that have been doing it for awhile and obviously do great work.
I think some way to get others in the list is a good idea. Perhaps updated daily or weekly for top downloads.
I think some way to get others in the list is a good idea. Perhaps updated daily or weekly for top downloads.
WOM
Reply #25 Friday, May 2, 2003 4:33 PM
Reply #25 Friday, May 2, 2003 4:33 PM
GhoS, The Top Authors is updated daily already as is the Top Downloads.
MadIce
Reply #26 Saturday, May 3, 2003 3:22 AM
Reply #26 Saturday, May 3, 2003 3:22 AM
Like I said the current lists do not aid new skinners, nor do they help bringing creativity back.
MadIce just wants to give skinners (new or experienced) a little attention on this site.
The site works fine if you want to download the latest and greatest skins. The current lists help them to make a choise. Downloaders can sort the skins anyway they want. Nothing wrong with that. I feel this should go on like that.
Users can get help if they post their question on the message board. KarmaGirl and a lot of others make sure those questions are answered. Nothing wrong with that either.
The message board is also being used for entertainment and to socialize. That's OK with me too.
Skinners can upload their skins and frankly that is all they can do on this site. Now this worries me. Like I said before times have changed and so are the ways skinners work. You cannot change how they work, but you can help them in their creative process. The Experimental section and the HotList would just be an aid. Nothing more, nothing less.
Some skinners feel that they should be number one (and of course it is great if your skins are rewarded by high download counts and ratings), but not all skinners feel that way. A lot of skinners skin because they love to do it. Some others see it as an art form. Every skinner may have his or her own reason why to skin.
It is hard to get even attention for this thread, because skinners are a minority. Lately we have seen posts about hijacking the topic in threads. I would go a step further. I feel that lately the message board is completely hijacked by nonsense, politics and religion. Interesting and fun subjects (that should be there to stay), but they have nothing to do with skinning. It will drive skinners away from sites like these.
Maybe we should organize the message board in subjects. In that way I don't feel like threads are hijacked (as apposed to topic hijacks). It is done on other sites and I think it works much better than having a message board like we have here.
I am just trying to find ways to help skinners in their work they enjoy and the skins they give us for free.
If you think about it then it is an investment to new great and creative skins in the future.
MadIce is already thinking about his next new post to "bump" this thread. Another new idea will be hard to find.
MadIce just wants to give skinners (new or experienced) a little attention on this site.
The site works fine if you want to download the latest and greatest skins. The current lists help them to make a choise. Downloaders can sort the skins anyway they want. Nothing wrong with that. I feel this should go on like that.
Users can get help if they post their question on the message board. KarmaGirl and a lot of others make sure those questions are answered. Nothing wrong with that either.
The message board is also being used for entertainment and to socialize. That's OK with me too.
Skinners can upload their skins and frankly that is all they can do on this site. Now this worries me. Like I said before times have changed and so are the ways skinners work. You cannot change how they work, but you can help them in their creative process. The Experimental section and the HotList would just be an aid. Nothing more, nothing less.
Some skinners feel that they should be number one (and of course it is great if your skins are rewarded by high download counts and ratings), but not all skinners feel that way. A lot of skinners skin because they love to do it. Some others see it as an art form. Every skinner may have his or her own reason why to skin.
It is hard to get even attention for this thread, because skinners are a minority. Lately we have seen posts about hijacking the topic in threads. I would go a step further. I feel that lately the message board is completely hijacked by nonsense, politics and religion. Interesting and fun subjects (that should be there to stay), but they have nothing to do with skinning. It will drive skinners away from sites like these.
Maybe we should organize the message board in subjects. In that way I don't feel like threads are hijacked (as apposed to topic hijacks). It is done on other sites and I think it works much better than having a message board like we have here.
I am just trying to find ways to help skinners in their work they enjoy and the skins they give us for free.
If you think about it then it is an investment to new great and creative skins in the future.
MadIce is already thinking about his next new post to "bump" this thread. Another new idea will be hard to find.
Jafo
Reply #27 Saturday, May 3, 2003 5:48 AM
Reply #27 Saturday, May 3, 2003 5:48 AM
I'm right behind the concept of getting the 'new' skinner into the spotlight....one way or another...
It's always important for the 'veteran' skinners to be aware of those new to the scene...that there ARE people totally unaware of what really has gone before and are blundering around in their relative 'dark', when others have a torch..
It's always important for the 'veteran' skinners to be aware of those new to the scene...that there ARE people totally unaware of what really has gone before and are blundering around in their relative 'dark', when others have a torch..
MadIce
Reply #28 Saturday, May 3, 2003 1:55 PM
Reply #28 Saturday, May 3, 2003 1:55 PM
MadIce lights Jafo's torch.
Now, lets see if that helps.
Now, lets see if that helps.
Lady_Akasha
Reply #32 Sunday, May 4, 2003 11:04 AM
Reply #32 Sunday, May 4, 2003 11:04 AM
»"That was the newbie jitters. Once you uploaded a few walls you calmed down didn't you Lady Akasha? And you became accepted in no time. Now people want to be like you. " #22 by JourneyMan WOM - 5/2/2003 3:14:43 PM
Well yes I have 'calmed down' since then however. I still get a bit of 'jitters' every time I upload one But that is because I still consider myself a minor in comparison to some of the others here. Though I will say that I very well remember that first upload, and how warm and welcoming the folks here were. Which makes a HUGE difference. Now if we added an extra spotlight on the newbies I think it would make it all the better. 
I know even I look at that Top Authors list and think "I'll get on there...one day..." While it is without question daunting, it's more inspiring,and it pushes me harder, for some it may just be daunting.
I try to the best of my ability to help newcomers as much as I can in the sense of, when they email me, with questions and the 'how can I start?' trying to answer questions as well as I can. And I even took it a step further and prepared a tutorial for the new to Bryce,as I totally understand how it is to look at these images and think "I want to make this... I think I could, but how do I start?"
As for people wanting to be like me...That is such a kind thing to say, but I still can't picture that.
Well yes I have 'calmed down' since then however. I still get a bit of 'jitters' every time I upload one
But that is because I still consider myself a minor in comparison to some of the others here. Though I will say that I very well remember that first upload, and how warm and welcoming the folks here were. Which makes a HUGE difference. Now if we added an extra spotlight on the newbies I think it would make it all the better. 
I know even I look at that Top Authors list and think "I'll get on there...one day..." While it is without question daunting, it's more inspiring,and it pushes me harder, for some it may just be daunting. I try to the best of my ability to help newcomers as much as I can in the sense of, when they email me, with questions and the 'how can I start?' trying to answer questions as well as I can. And I even took it a step further and prepared a tutorial for the new to Bryce,as I totally understand how it is to look at these images and think "I want to make this... I think I could, but how do I start?"
As for people wanting to be like me...That is such a kind thing to say, but I still can't picture that.
MadIce
Reply #33 Sunday, May 4, 2003 12:07 PM
Reply #33 Sunday, May 4, 2003 12:07 PM
Lady Alasha: That is what I mean. You are willing to help out. So are most other skinners. It would be so much easier to have something like the Experimental Section. Not only new skinners, but experienced skinners still learn new things every day. The post of pjpowell is a good example of that.
DarkMist
Reply #34 Sunday, May 4, 2003 3:29 PM
Reply #34 Sunday, May 4, 2003 3:29 PM
Tutorial section would benefit many including me, especially for WB skinning etc
Lady_Akasha
Reply #35 Sunday, May 4, 2003 6:59 PM
Reply #35 Sunday, May 4, 2003 6:59 PM
MadIce: Oh the experimental section again I think is brilliant, it's something I myself would take advantage of as there is so much I want to learn. I would love that.
virophile
Reply #36 Sunday, May 4, 2003 8:22 PM
Reply #36 Sunday, May 4, 2003 8:22 PM
i think something that ties both the experimental section and helping out new skinners is the fact that most of us made are fist skin by disecting one of our favorites, then we over wrote that, it is easy to fall into a pattern. A new feature is added and we incorporate in but I think we are pretty much stuck into our pattern/style still, then again maybe not but it would still be fun
but it would still be fun
BoBoMoe
Reply #37 Monday, May 5, 2003 8:06 AM
Reply #37 Monday, May 5, 2003 8:06 AM
I like the idea of rookie of the day or week Information seems to be at a premium so more tuturals and FAQs would be a welcome addition.
Information seems to be at a premium so more tuturals and FAQs would be a welcome addition.
DarkMist
Reply #38 Tuesday, May 6, 2003 6:02 AM
Reply #38 Tuesday, May 6, 2003 6:02 AM
What we need is 2 Top Authors lists...1 for the Experienced and one for the newbies like me.
If thats gonna become complicated or whatever then just stop the download count altogether then all the petty squabling will have no choice but to end.
To me it seems the list is contributing to peoples ego rather than confidence to continue and grow.
No one new can compete with the downloads being raked in everyday by 'experienced' and changing the way things are counted are just annoying the people who should be top of the list.
Just entering a vicious circle that has to be looked at and ended.
If thats gonna become complicated or whatever then just stop the download count altogether then all the petty squabling will have no choice but to end.
To me it seems the list is contributing to peoples ego rather than confidence to continue and grow.
No one new can compete with the downloads being raked in everyday by 'experienced' and changing the way things are counted are just annoying the people who should be top of the list.
Just entering a vicious circle that has to be looked at and ended.
MadIce
Reply #39 Tuesday, May 6, 2003 6:16 AM
Reply #39 Tuesday, May 6, 2003 6:16 AM
Dark Mist: Yes. That is my idea too. That is why I started this thread in the first place. The Top Downloads/Authors list are nice, but these do not support new talent. And new talent is what we need for the future. Not just popular skins, but also good quality ones. That is why it would be great to combine it with the Experimental section.
[Message Edited]
[Message Edited]
DarkMist
Reply #40 Tuesday, May 6, 2003 6:34 AM
Reply #40 Tuesday, May 6, 2003 6:34 AM
But the way its going its simply 'kicking' out the old for the new.
Without the old then nothing will evolve from it, they are here to learn from not to try and beat or make them obsolete
Without the old then nothing will evolve from it, they are here to learn from not to try and beat or make them obsolete
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Reply #21 Friday, May 2, 2003 2:49 PM
The experimental section that is such a fantastic idea. As someone who is still on the newer side, I know what that would've mean to me. I remember looking at other's work, thinking... "I want to do this, but where would I even begin???" Hell I still do