The Rating System
Wednesday, December 11, 2002 by JamMeister33 | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
Now, don't get me wrong, I am for the rating system; however, I think that once a person who has the privilege of being able to rate a skin has made a choice, they should not be able to go back and change it.
The rating system is being abused by malicious minded people who either have a grudge, or just get a twisted
pleasure out of having the power to negatively influence other people's hard work.
The rating system is being abused by malicious minded people who either have a grudge, or just get a twisted
pleasure out of having the power to negatively influence other people's hard work.
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JamMeister33
Reply #42 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:10 PM
Reply #42 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:10 PM
I gave bakerstreet's wallpaper a '10' rating, no ifs, ands or buts.... 
migellito
Reply #43 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:10 PM
Reply #43 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:10 PM
i'd like some clarity here.
is the main problem some people have with ratings just that some ratings are low? your skin or wall you worked on and liked well enough to upload got a low rating? or you feel sorry for someone who got a low rating on their piece?
or is it that many ratings are far too high for mediocre work?
if it's the first, i think we need to remember that any time work of any kind is graded or rated in any forum, whether on the internet or not, it's a tool used to try to improve quality - usually the quality of the exhibition. it's not a device for making people feel better, or bolstering their confidence. we should not give out high ratings or avoid giving low ones for the sole purpose of 'not hurting somebody's feelings.' that's not what it's about. it's about the quality of the work, and sometimes the work isn't very good. yes, they tried - maybe they could have tried harder, maybe not. but if the work isn't good, it isn't good, and even though it might hurt their pride a bit, they deserve to know. they are still are friends, and what we think of them as a person remains unchanged.
if it's the second, i agree. looking through the site [particularly the wallpapers] there are many mediocre pieces rated too high. i would imagine this is due to 'getting one's buddies to pad it' or a misplaced sentiment of 'not wanting to hurt their feelings.' as far as i can see, there's no real way to combat this, and frankly it's not out of hand, but rather an occasional bother. it generally evens out, as i now routinely see -many- pieces with nearly a dozen or so ratings.
as i've said countless times before, compared to what it's like trying to get your work shown in a 'brick n mortar' gallery, or trying to sell it to design clients, the ratings system and moderation policies here at wincustomize are incredibly forgiving.
hopefully, when one sees their work online here and rated well, they feel a great sense of accomplishment.
is the main problem some people have with ratings just that some ratings are low? your skin or wall you worked on and liked well enough to upload got a low rating? or you feel sorry for someone who got a low rating on their piece?
or is it that many ratings are far too high for mediocre work?
if it's the first, i think we need to remember that any time work of any kind is graded or rated in any forum, whether on the internet or not, it's a tool used to try to improve quality - usually the quality of the exhibition. it's not a device for making people feel better, or bolstering their confidence. we should not give out high ratings or avoid giving low ones for the sole purpose of 'not hurting somebody's feelings.' that's not what it's about. it's about the quality of the work, and sometimes the work isn't very good. yes, they tried - maybe they could have tried harder, maybe not. but if the work isn't good, it isn't good, and even though it might hurt their pride a bit, they deserve to know. they are still are friends, and what we think of them as a person remains unchanged.
if it's the second, i agree. looking through the site [particularly the wallpapers] there are many mediocre pieces rated too high. i would imagine this is due to 'getting one's buddies to pad it' or a misplaced sentiment of 'not wanting to hurt their feelings.' as far as i can see, there's no real way to combat this, and frankly it's not out of hand, but rather an occasional bother. it generally evens out, as i now routinely see -many- pieces with nearly a dozen or so ratings.
as i've said countless times before, compared to what it's like trying to get your work shown in a 'brick n mortar' gallery, or trying to sell it to design clients, the ratings system and moderation policies here at wincustomize are incredibly forgiving.
hopefully, when one sees their work online here and rated well, they feel a great sense of accomplishment.
T-Man
Reply #44 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:18 PM
Reply #44 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:18 PM
"Jammy, I agree that once a piece has been rated by someone, they shouldn't be able to rate it again. "
It actually was like this at one time. However, it was changed to accomodate those who continually update their skins.
What used to happen is that once you updated your skin, all the previous ratings were thrown out because the skin has changed so the Rating was essentially out of date. This cause a problem with most updated skins have 0 or 1 number of ratings.
So, what I did was change it so that the old ratings were not thrown out but a person could re-rate (not give an additional rating) the skin.
It actually was like this at one time. However, it was changed to accomodate those who continually update their skins.
What used to happen is that once you updated your skin, all the previous ratings were thrown out because the skin has changed so the Rating was essentially out of date. This cause a problem with most updated skins have 0 or 1 number of ratings.
So, what I did was change it so that the old ratings were not thrown out but a person could re-rate (not give an additional rating) the skin.
JamMeister33
Reply #45 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:19 PM
Reply #45 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:19 PM
Migellito, the point is about certain 'people' maliciously giving low ratings to someone they don't like for their own twisted enjoyment.
Angel_Wings
Reply #46 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:20 PM
Reply #46 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:20 PM
Whatever JM. I'm not your enemy nor your friend and I'm sure you feel the same so there should be no argument there. So, please, stop the "name calling" as it's utterly childish and below you. I won't speak to you any more and you do the same and life goes on. All I ever tried to do was be polite and even compassionate to you until you started in with the weird comments so please move on and find someone else to target. K?
Make friends, sing songs...be jovial...life is short.
Happy holidays...and a happy new year.
Buh bye
Make friends, sing songs...be jovial...life is short.
Happy holidays...and a happy new year.
Buh bye
migellito
Reply #47 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:26 PM
Reply #47 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:26 PM
hi 
if this conversation between jm and ds needs to go any further, please take it to email.
thanks
if this conversation between jm and ds needs to go any further, please take it to email.
thanks
JamMeister33
Reply #48 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:29 PM
Reply #48 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:29 PM
Personally, I wish she would just drop it already, I don't wish to speak with her at all, at any time, for any reason.
messybuu
Reply #49 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 2:26 PM
Reply #49 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 2:26 PM
I think when they have WinCustomize be able to rate skins, the actual people that are rating skins will increase, at least by one.
Fuzzy Logic
Reply #50 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 2:45 PM
Reply #50 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 2:45 PM
migellito: if this conversation between jm and ds needs to go any further, please take it to email.
I said similar back at post No3 but no-one was listening...
I said similar back at post No3 but no-one was listening...
JamMeister33
Reply #53 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 2:55 PM
Reply #53 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 2:55 PM
Ummmm, Fuzzy....you're the one keeping this thread going.
It already died awhile ago.....thank goodness.
Now, how 'bout some nice chocolates?...
It already died awhile ago.....thank goodness.
Now, how 'bout some nice chocolates?...
Lecrayon
Reply #55 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 3:02 PM
Reply #55 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 3:02 PM
Migellito, I think the people that visit here often see sometimes biased ratings on skins. Whether these are walls or WB or whatever. I think that most people who submit skins here know very well what they are doing. And also know very well how much work is put into it. I have nothing against Jafo, but his last 2 walls submitted here would have been moderated on instant if I had uploaded them. In his comments he even agrees and what are they doing in the walls section then anyway? On one hand you want the "best of the best", on the other hand things creep in "at least not very good at all". I have nothing against MikeB, but his cursor is not as good as a whole lot of Jalentorn ones that didn't even got to a 10. Also his colony WB wasn't a 10 in my eyes compared to the BorgX skin. It wasn't very original either. Speaking of buddies to pad. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against their work or against them personally, I am merely stating some facts and I don't think I am the only one that sees it like this. If you want to be leading, try to be objective and lead. And sometimes listen to constructive criticism rather than hold on to conservative defense. I don't mind ratings, we have spoken about it before, and I have said then that if you downgrade a skin you need to give constructive criticism. Only downgrading a skin makes someone only wonder why. (Yeah, I know, you are all too busy to give constructive criticism) Look at motions thread, he still wonders why.
Lecrayon
Reply #56 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 3:03 PM
Reply #56 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 3:03 PM
ooooopsssssssss got the thread still going too I guess....Me runs off... 
Lecrayon
Reply #57 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 3:05 PM
Reply #57 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 3:05 PM
But I do have something against ratings if it comes into play as an excluding factor. 
bakerstreet
Reply #58 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 3:55 PM
Reply #58 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 3:55 PM
I think anyone that spends more than a glance pondering their 'ratings' is wasting their time.
10='I love it'
1='this sucks'
If people can't string a few meaningful thoughts together about something, then the number they rate it at is meaningless. I kind of notice the first rating I get, because I know where that comes from. Ratings beyond that, I couldn't care less, since I also *know* where they come from. I'm really not gonna lose sleep if someone doesn't like something I made because it doesn't match their Hello Kitty wallpaper.
Downloads are meaningless as well. People can't judge a piece until they have used it. I would rather have ten downloads that stayed on the desktop for a month than a million that went straight to the recycle bin. Sure, I want people to use what I offer, but I would be silly to think that a tenth of the people who download what I make ever actually do.
Anyone who thinks about their work, spends time on it, and is proud enough to upload it really isn't gonna be helped or harmed by an anonymous number. If you upload stuff in order to find out if something is good you are doing everyone a disservice. End-users who need numbers to decide if a piece is good enough to download have no meaningful opinion, so how much worse is it when the artists themselves need to see that number to decide if their own work is of quality? You made it, did you do a quality job?
To sum up, if you are plagued by doubt because of your ratings, then it probably *isn't* because of your ratings.
10='I love it'
1='this sucks'
If people can't string a few meaningful thoughts together about something, then the number they rate it at is meaningless. I kind of notice the first rating I get, because I know where that comes from. Ratings beyond that, I couldn't care less, since I also *know* where they come from. I'm really not gonna lose sleep if someone doesn't like something I made because it doesn't match their Hello Kitty wallpaper.
Downloads are meaningless as well. People can't judge a piece until they have used it. I would rather have ten downloads that stayed on the desktop for a month than a million that went straight to the recycle bin. Sure, I want people to use what I offer, but I would be silly to think that a tenth of the people who download what I make ever actually do.
Anyone who thinks about their work, spends time on it, and is proud enough to upload it really isn't gonna be helped or harmed by an anonymous number. If you upload stuff in order to find out if something is good you are doing everyone a disservice. End-users who need numbers to decide if a piece is good enough to download have no meaningful opinion, so how much worse is it when the artists themselves need to see that number to decide if their own work is of quality? You made it, did you do a quality job?
To sum up, if you are plagued by doubt because of your ratings, then it probably *isn't* because of your ratings.
JamMeister33
Reply #59 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 4:22 PM
Reply #59 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 4:22 PM
Well, I like to see high numbers, call it personal vanity and I'd admit that willingly. High ratings and download numbers indicate to me that the people I made the skin for like it that much. Since I want people to like my work this indicates to me that they do in fact appreciate my hard work. If my reasoning seems faulty or illogical to you, that is your opinion and you are certainly entitled to it. Your opinion has no bearing on anything that I do now, or in the future.
btw bakerstreet, Jafo assures me that you are in all actuality a very nice man. I respect his opinions...
btw bakerstreet, Jafo assures me that you are in all actuality a very nice man. I respect his opinions...
bakerstreet
Reply #60 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 4:37 PM
Reply #60 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 4:37 PM
You mean my opinion has no bearing unless it is a anonymous, numeric opinion, right? lol...
reread my post. High download numbers mean nothing, only that people have downloaded it. And you as much as anyone should know how much number ratings mean. Come on, your conversation is up there for everyone to see. I would rather have a single appreciative email from a user than a 10 rating any day.
I would give your reasoning [Rating: 4] I'll stick to replying to you with numbers since you like those better
reread my post. High download numbers mean nothing, only that people have downloaded it. And you as much as anyone should know how much number ratings mean. Come on, your conversation is up there for everyone to see. I would rather have a single appreciative email from a user than a 10 rating any day.
I would give your reasoning [Rating: 4] I'll stick to replying to you with numbers since you like those better
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Reply #41 Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:07 PM
#39 by darkseraphim.com - 12/11/2002 12:32:56 PM
by JamMeister33 - 12/11/2002 1:50:57 AM
Hmmm. I didn't want to "GO THERE" BUT...This whole stupid thread started from someone who gleefully wrote me that he'd down-rated Bakerstreet's wallpaper out of "revenge"...
Now that statement is patently untrue, and you are just trying to stir things up as usual, Devil Witch, or whoever you are today. You don't want to "GO THERE" ?... all you DO is go there.