Family Site? What has happened?
Wednesday, December 17, 2003 by Phoon | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
I normally try to maintain a fairly even, supportive attitude here and try not to stir the fires too much, but when it comes to something like this, it is time to stand up and say something.
https://www.wincustomize.com/skins.asp?library=8&SkinID=14200
Supposedly, this is a Family oriented site. Am I mistaken in that?
I feel that material such as this has no business at all on WC, nor do I understand how this made it passed moderation.
Now, I'm certainly no saint and my objection to this type of material here does not reflect any negativity at all on the person which submitted this, nor does it reflect on my own personal taste in art. I do however feel that this type of material demonstrates a very negative image on the community we have here and should not be allowed.
So break out your flame throwers upon me if you must, I am prepared.
https://www.wincustomize.com/skins.asp?library=8&SkinID=14200
Supposedly, this is a Family oriented site. Am I mistaken in that?
I feel that material such as this has no business at all on WC, nor do I understand how this made it passed moderation.
Now, I'm certainly no saint and my objection to this type of material here does not reflect any negativity at all on the person which submitted this, nor does it reflect on my own personal taste in art. I do however feel that this type of material demonstrates a very negative image on the community we have here and should not be allowed.
So break out your flame throwers upon me if you must, I am prepared.
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craeonics
Reply #22 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 3:55 PM
Reply #22 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 3:55 PM
Now we know. I say, "big" fuss over nothing, but I seem to be a minority.
Question becomes then: what will happen to it? Oh wait, it's gone.
Question becomes then: what will happen to it? Oh wait, it's gone.
kongit
Reply #23 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 3:59 PM
Reply #23 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 3:59 PM
I really don't care. If I had kids I wouldn't want them putting pictures of beer products on the desktop, but personally I have nothing wrong with putting some on mine. I feel its more of a parents responsibility to keep their kids from doing things that they don't like. Some parents wouldn't care at all if their shild had a marijuana leaf on the desktop.
WebGizmos
Reply #24 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:16 PM
Reply #24 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:16 PM
Geez...I thought this was about something pornographic, but it's just about the depiction of a marijuana cigarette? I had better not see anything to do with alcohol on here then. I mean really...and this is no slash at SirPhoon...he is certainly entitled to his opinion...but there is absolutely "nothing" wrong with marijuana despite this governments attempt at continually blowing smoke...no pun intended...up peoples butts. Alcohol kills more people than marijuana ever could, but yet we accept the depiction of alcoholic content here? Maybe WC should take those skins down? In fact I don't know one person that has ever died from marijuana, but lost many to alcohol. And by the way, I am a former indulger of marijuana so my comments come from experience not propaganda. I would be far more upset seeing my kids indulging in alcohol than marijuana, and that would only be because they could wind up in jail for something harmless. And how about the glorification of government agencies on this site...some of the biggest murderers known to man...thats ok? Maybe WC should take all those down as well. Personally, I think people have become way to thin skinned and controlled in this country, let the book burning begin...again!
So far I have found "nothing" offensive here at WC, but even if I did and was entitled to my opinion, I wouldn't expect some artists work to be burned from the site because of one persons opinion. The term community does not apply to one persons...opinion...since we are a community made up of vast differences in opinion...but if it was the vast "majority" of the community that found something offensive I could understand. But a website should cater to "everyones" tastes, while respecting peoples opinions. Just as we have channel changer buttons on a remote, we also have back buttons on our keyboards. JMO
And IPlural...I'd love to see some Furry Freak Brothers skins!...
[Message Edited]
So far I have found "nothing" offensive here at WC, but even if I did and was entitled to my opinion, I wouldn't expect some artists work to be burned from the site because of one persons opinion. The term community does not apply to one persons...opinion...since we are a community made up of vast differences in opinion...but if it was the vast "majority" of the community that found something offensive I could understand. But a website should cater to "everyones" tastes, while respecting peoples opinions. Just as we have channel changer buttons on a remote, we also have back buttons on our keyboards. JMO
And IPlural...I'd love to see some Furry Freak Brothers skins!...
[Message Edited]
EventHorizon
Reply #25 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:20 PM
Reply #25 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:20 PM
Was it really all that good of a wall though? (As far as quality) Did it deserve to be accepted...regardless of the fact that it had a pack of cigarettes and a marijuana leaf on it?
IPlural
Reply #26 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:25 PM
Reply #26 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:25 PM
if a 3d render, yes...
complex is not always best and yet even as simple as it seems, it is correct and well rendered
complex is not always best and yet even as simple as it seems, it is correct and well rendered
WOM
Reply #27 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:25 PM
Reply #27 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:25 PM
Well, it was a black wall so the icons would have stood out. Modt blinds could have gone with it. Who knows. I wouldn't have downloaded it.
HG_Eliminator
Reply #28 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:28 PM
this phrase is like saying if a person walks out side in the nude. its the parents fault if their kids see them ..its everyones responsibility to temper their freedom with a little morality.
with internet freedom comes the responsibility to shield our young to the unseemly side of the world til they are old enough to understand them...it takes a village to raise a balanced child.
this like only a handfull of sites has become a site where i can (as a family) surf with my kids without the fear of seeing drug or adult material. it soso nice to find a site where u can go with ur kids online and not worry abt exposeing them to such materials...if u want an adult section then maybe poll the admins to set aside an adult section specifically for those type of images.. but dont mix them with images set out for users all ages...
[Message Edited]
Reply #28 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:28 PM
| I feel its more of a parents responsibility to keep their kids from doing things that they don't like. |
this phrase is like saying if a person walks out side in the nude. its the parents fault if their kids see them ..its everyones responsibility to temper their freedom with a little morality.
with internet freedom comes the responsibility to shield our young to the unseemly side of the world til they are old enough to understand them...it takes a village to raise a balanced child.
this like only a handfull of sites has become a site where i can (as a family) surf with my kids without the fear of seeing drug or adult material. it soso nice to find a site where u can go with ur kids online and not worry abt exposeing them to such materials...if u want an adult section then maybe poll the admins to set aside an adult section specifically for those type of images.. but dont mix them with images set out for users all ages...
[Message Edited]
WebGizmos
Reply #30 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:32 PM
Reply #30 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:32 PM
Oh...I guess there is no point in working on a sixties theme skin? So much for freedom of speech and expression!...Once again the people are oppressed... 
Leo the Lion
Reply #31 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:37 PM
Reply #31 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:37 PM
Damn.......I missed all the fun.......but without seeing the article concerned i still get a very vivid picture in my head of what it must have looked like.........and for what its worth Phoon - I'm with you on this and there is no place for it here on WC 
HG_Eliminator
Reply #32 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:48 PM
ok this i am offended by. my father (like his father,and most my family) were in the military. quite a few died defending the principals in which our country was founded. my father in 95 died of cancer due to exposure of agent orange in vietnam. i will probably succumb to the same fate, hence the agent orange (by military admission) can be passed to the future generations of off spring.
the many men and women of the armed forces serve with the distinguished desire to protect freedom. even your freedom to bash them). so unless uve ever stood up to defend any thing (other than ur ability to offend ) dont EVER sugest they are any thing like drug dealers or porn peddlers.
Reply #32 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 4:48 PM
| And how about the glorification of government agencies on this site...some of the biggest murderers known to man...thats ok? |
ok this i am offended by. my father (like his father,and most my family) were in the military. quite a few died defending the principals in which our country was founded. my father in 95 died of cancer due to exposure of agent orange in vietnam. i will probably succumb to the same fate, hence the agent orange (by military admission) can be passed to the future generations of off spring.
the many men and women of the armed forces serve with the distinguished desire to protect freedom. even your freedom to bash them). so unless uve ever stood up to defend any thing (other than ur ability to offend ) dont EVER sugest they are any thing like drug dealers or porn peddlers.
WebGizmos
Reply #33 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 5:11 PM
Reply #33 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 5:11 PM
I am certainly NOT referring to those who serve in the military...I am referring to the ones putting you in harms way for their own personal gain though. The ones who I have no doubt knew full well that you and your family would be exposed to agent orange. And yes HG...I have put my own freedom on the line to stand up for my beliefs...I've done so since the sixties and I will continue to do it every day of my life. I do not take it lightly that people have fought and died for the freedom I have. What offends me is that those people...in some cases...died for selfish reasons of others...to protect some politicians investments...not neccessarily our freedom, which is a byproduct of their actions. The desires of others to protect our freedom is by all means a noble undertaking... which I for one would never dream of offending...that was a misunderstanding on your part. It was not the employees of the government I was referring to...it's the socalled rulers, the ones sitting behind the desks who could care less about the people...except at election time or when their investments are at risk.
And I don't believe I even remotely suggested that our armed forces were anything like drug dealers or pornography peddlers. Your understandable anger is directed at the wrong person. And I am sincerely sorry to hear about your father and your possible fate. But you just made my point about them murdering people for selfish reasons.
[Message Edited]
And I don't believe I even remotely suggested that our armed forces were anything like drug dealers or pornography peddlers. Your understandable anger is directed at the wrong person. And I am sincerely sorry to hear about your father and your possible fate. But you just made my point about them murdering people for selfish reasons.
[Message Edited]
Apocalypse_67
Reply #34 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 5:16 PM
Same here Leo >
Working overtime it's cutting into my 'fun time' @ WC.
Im gonna have to talk to my boss about this >
Reply #34 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 5:16 PM
| Damn.......I missed all the fun....... |
Same here Leo >
Working overtime it's cutting into my 'fun time' @ WC.
Im gonna have to talk to my boss about this >
Leo the Lion
Reply #35 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 5:23 PM
Reply #35 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 5:23 PM
Tell me about it AP67
My "boss" is out tonight so i got the place all to myself. Just cracked open a can of Fosters (otherwise known as Jafo's Juice) and just going to chill out........surfing the net for hidden skinning gems as usual
My "boss" is out tonight so i got the place all to myself. Just cracked open a can of Fosters (otherwise known as Jafo's Juice) and just going to chill out........surfing the net for hidden skinning gems as usual
IPlural
Reply #36 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 5:44 PM
morality integrity, ethics, chastity; conformity to accepted rules of conduct
which is totally subjective...
I would assume that rules would depict what is socially acceptable and what is not.
It does not promote drug use covertly nor overtly in my opinion.
What does is what it is, for those who find it to be acceptable and download it to use as they will, great.
For those who do not, they do not have to download it and can pass it by.
Some towns in the heart land of the USA burned Harry Potter books over their perception of what is morally correct.
Does that mean that every book store in those town had to not only remove but ban anything to do with Harry Potter?
I can tell you from personal experience that censorship in it's mildest and simplistic form is the is the most dangerous of all.
That is exactly what it would be to not have rules in place before hand which explicatively direct that no such submission will even be taken into consideration.
Otherwise you leave the Moderator's in the position of being painted into the proverbial corner, or up one stinky creek without a paddle.
On one side you have the person who submits who feels they are being wrongly denied the right to submit work because of political reasons and such.
On the other hand you have those who will claim that the site is morally corrupt for even considering if not accepting such walls.
Moderation was and has been and always will be a contentious necessary need on this site and all others.
What one finds as art another will find a waste of bandwidth.
Moderation temperance, quality of being moderate, instance of being moderated
temperance moderation, "restraint"
I would and will not download it, but that does not mean I think it is beyond the means of moderation and as such, considering it passed, then it is site specifically acceptable.
Guess I am saying that I will not loose any sleep over it being on the site and my kids had drugs stuck in their face in grade school, a picture on a web site isn't making me loose any sleep.
Reply #36 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 5:44 PM
| temper their freedom with a little morality. |
morality integrity, ethics, chastity; conformity to accepted rules of conduct
which is totally subjective...
I would assume that rules would depict what is socially acceptable and what is not.
It does not promote drug use covertly nor overtly in my opinion.
What does is what it is, for those who find it to be acceptable and download it to use as they will, great.
For those who do not, they do not have to download it and can pass it by.
Some towns in the heart land of the USA burned Harry Potter books over their perception of what is morally correct.
Does that mean that every book store in those town had to not only remove but ban anything to do with Harry Potter?
I can tell you from personal experience that censorship in it's mildest and simplistic form is the is the most dangerous of all.
That is exactly what it would be to not have rules in place before hand which explicatively direct that no such submission will even be taken into consideration.
Otherwise you leave the Moderator's in the position of being painted into the proverbial corner, or up one stinky creek without a paddle.
On one side you have the person who submits who feels they are being wrongly denied the right to submit work because of political reasons and such.
On the other hand you have those who will claim that the site is morally corrupt for even considering if not accepting such walls.
Moderation was and has been and always will be a contentious necessary need on this site and all others.
What one finds as art another will find a waste of bandwidth.
Moderation temperance, quality of being moderate, instance of being moderated
temperance moderation, "restraint"
I would and will not download it, but that does not mean I think it is beyond the means of moderation and as such, considering it passed, then it is site specifically acceptable.
Guess I am saying that I will not loose any sleep over it being on the site and my kids had drugs stuck in their face in grade school, a picture on a web site isn't making me loose any sleep.
HG_Eliminator
Reply #37 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 7:50 PM
Reply #37 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 7:50 PM
yes but thats part of the problem.. **ahh im not gona worry abt it here or ive seen worse*** .. maybe if people had stood up for whats rite instead of sayin well thas ok its tolerable ..ur kids wouldnt have had drugs offered to them at that age ..the problem being the ** hey its ok it dont effect me **.or the **id rather them be doin this than that**..kind of thinking ...when did we as humans start tolerateing and accepting the lesser of the two evil's?.. we should accept none..if we dont stand up and say we dont want this,its not tolerable. then we are dommed to revert back to the barbarian stages where anything goes ....the social decline of society is invariably the allowing things that dont seem so bad but arent common til they become common. then it will go to the next step .. eventually we will have no boundaries as to whats rite and wrong .
IPlural
Reply #38 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 8:11 PM
Reply #38 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 8:11 PM
mmmm....
it isn't rocket science....
but I can make my position a lot clearer...
I am not a moderator and I do not decide what is or what is not acceptable.
If you happen to change the opinion of what is acceptable, then power to you.
I for one do not hold issue with it one way or the other and am more than willing to leave it up to those whom are charged with deciding on what is acceptable to do it...
it isn't rocket science....
but I can make my position a lot clearer...
I am not a moderator and I do not decide what is or what is not acceptable.
If you happen to change the opinion of what is acceptable, then power to you.
I for one do not hold issue with it one way or the other and am more than willing to leave it up to those whom are charged with deciding on what is acceptable to do it...
Sugaree
Reply #39 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 8:14 PM
Reply #39 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 8:14 PM
I've been pretty wholesome the past few days... sooo I knew this thread wasn't because of me 
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Reply #21 Wednesday, December 17, 2003 3:34 PM