John Grudger Part 2
Saturday, November 22, 2003 by Frogboy | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
I have closed the other thread since ChichiGirl's husband was trying to turn it into a totally different topic of "Where's my wife's OD refund" (to which all I can say is I'll ask about it on Monday, I think I along with every admin on this site want to ensure that there is no reason whatsoever for chichigirl or her husband to have to visit this site).
But apparently this author's skins: https://www.wincustomize.com/skins.asp?authorid=222721 are claimed by ChiChigirl too.
I checked my email for emails from Chichi, there are a lot of them over the past number of years, and there was one in Feburary that made a mention of this person's skins.
Apparently there is dispute between John Grudger and ChiChigirl over who has rights on these skins. ChiChiGirl claims to have co-designed them. John Grudger claims to have made them. We don't know, but it is up to the accuser to provide the evidence and as one might not be surprised to hear, we are not favorably disposed to ChiChiGirl given her past behavior to take her at her word.
Jafo - whatever you think is best is okay with me. It's a sticky situation. What apparently sparked it was that John updated his/her skins again and uploaded a bunch of new ones recently which sparked this new episode. If ChiChiGirl can prove she authored the skins then they are hers and those skins should be removed. Though it remains beyond me why someone would want to rip ChiChiGirl's skins.
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Reply #24 Saturday, November 22, 2003 2:53 AM
Reply #25 Saturday, November 22, 2003 4:25 AM
Look at all the other blinds by JG, only one (Flora) is totally different. I immediately thought it has a chichi touch, whether he was inspired by her skins or not, nobody knows but only the people involved. Then I see a comment on skinbase by chichi, and I, for one think it's a bit fishy.
How on earth can you investigate if it was agreed between these people not to upload that skin, and suddenly you see yours, you participated in, published. I think that would be a shocker to everyone, whether it is chichi or say treetog.(And now that it published you can't even prove it by sending the skin you made together) On skinbase she just said she wanted credit for participating, and since that is also wincusto policy to give credit where credit is due that seemed fair. Only thing that remains is, who do you believe
Oh and JG did say to me they cooperated making skins, he also claims to have been teaching her in making WB. I did delete all correspondence with that guy though, I don't want to have negativity in my environment. So would you believe me if I said that. 
[Message Edited]
[Message Edited]
Reply #26 Saturday, November 22, 2003 6:41 AM
Reply #27 Saturday, November 22, 2003 7:18 AM
Lecrayon....I fail to see where you fit into this discussion, as you are neither of the two parties who were obliged to determine whether the work was to be uploaded or not.
As already stated, if there was a 'falling out' of colaboration between a co-operative partnership at whatever stage it is not the responsibility of this site or its admins to determine what these 'partners' did or did not decide was to be done.....and certainly not for any casual third party.
This reason alone is why it is suggested that private email communication is appropriate, not public dirty laundry, good or bad.
My belief is that the public version of affairs is possibly less than exact, but other than that, much is a mystery [as it should be as it's actually none of our business]...
Reply #28 Saturday, November 22, 2003 7:27 AM
Reply #29 Saturday, November 22, 2003 7:32 AM
Reply #31 Saturday, November 22, 2003 8:04 AM
Jafo, I know that you don't like me. Thanks for reminding me I fail to fit in. I wish I have never said anything about everything. I got a whole lot of rubbish thrown over me and I got sick of it. In itself wincusto is a friendly place, and stardock programs are a nice treat. But sometimes it is like people get a "troublemaker mark" after their name, and all they can do is say only positive remarks, in order not to get personally attacked by mail, from admins or whomever.
I fail to see where that fits in. I have respect for your work here at WC, but you are not always right and neither am I.
Reply #32 Saturday, November 22, 2003 8:13 AM
Jacob...then you know in error, as there are very few people on this planet that can rub me sufficiently to extract a 'I do not like' response.
Some a 'disappointed' some a 'frustrated' some an 'annoyed' but precious few make it to 'I do not like'....that tends to be reserved for the Scott Sproats of this world [and the next]...
Reply #33 Saturday, November 22, 2003 8:26 AM
good to know, you are sometimes so sharp with your fingers I start bleeding. No hurt feelings then.
Reply #35 Saturday, November 22, 2003 10:47 AM
| Some a 'disappointed' some a 'frustrated' some an 'annoyed' but precious few make it to 'I do not like'....that tends to be reserved for the Scott Sproats of this world [and the next]... |
he gets disappointed and fusterated at me all the time. So does KG.
Reply #36 Saturday, November 22, 2003 11:40 AM
#27 by Admin Jafo - 11/22/2003 7:18:20 AM
not to disrespect anyone here, but I have seen w/ my own eyes the "exact" same things posted here by other ppl (whos names I wont say cuz I consider them friends) and not one person ever blinks but rather jumps to help them regardless of "proof" cuz their work was visually identified as being their work and ppl would jump to their e-mail apps and begin the fight on their behalf "immediately"
Reply #37 Saturday, November 22, 2003 11:50 AM
Doreen: Yes, if the posted work was identified as the work of someone else then it would be removed.
The problem in this particular case is that it is one of collaboration. Treetog, Mormegil, Alexandrie, and many other top skinners have provided a great deal of help to other skinners over the years.
Heck, one particularly well known icon/DX author who left in a huff about a year ago received a massive amount of help from Mormegil on technique and artwork.
But do they go around insisting that those people remove their work because they collaborated? No.
So where the issue exists is that ChiChi contends that they agreed he would not distribute the skins and apparently he says there was no such agreement. Even ChiChi doesn't claim to have made these skins. Only collaborated on them (helped).
Like Jafo said, it is not our place to decide what to do.
Reply #38 Saturday, November 22, 2003 12:01 PM
I myself would tell the guy to simply post her name in his comments and give credit where credit is due in respect. since she "obviously" had her hand on them WB's and anyone of us that knows chichi knows that Flora and Rainbow have chichi written all over them "or" this guy has one extremely feminine chichi side to him or something.
anyways, not my biz you guys do your thing I just had to voice "my opinion" and I mean no disrespect to anyone here *sigh*
Reply #39 Saturday, November 22, 2003 12:10 PM
Then ChiChi would be asking for a double standard - other skins and themes are not required to list everyone who helped them.
ChiChi and her husband get "bashed" because they are incredibly nasty to people. This whole issue should have been handled privately between the parties. ChiChi and Hobnobber bring these problems on themselves because of their own behavior.
Reply #40 Saturday, November 22, 2003 12:14 PM
anyways again not my biz I just hope it all gets resolved...
(I prob need to just shut my fingers up)
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Reply #21 Saturday, November 22, 2003 1:44 AM