Creation vs. Evolution
Thursday, September 11, 2003 by grayhaze | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
I thought I'd pre-empt this discussion before Kona's comment in the other thread sparked it off there. There is concrete proof that we evolved, but no proof that we were created. What's you're opinion, and why?
To quote Phoebe from Friends: "I guess the real question is who put those fossils there and why?"
To quote Phoebe from Friends: "I guess the real question is who put those fossils there and why?"
 |
|
Page 47 of 56 | |
|
|---|
joetheblow
Reply #922 Sunday, November 2, 2003 3:44 AM
Reply #922 Sunday, November 2, 2003 3:44 AM
It would be a pinky pinky finger by the way. Not a new thumb or some large index finger or something.
So now you will have more 'pigies' that will run all the way home.
So now you will have more 'pigies' that will run all the way home.
bakerstreet
Reply #923 Sunday, November 2, 2003 4:36 AM
Reply #923 Sunday, November 2, 2003 4:36 AM
The magician shows you a ball, moves it from hand to hand, opens his hands, and the ball is gone. He reaches up, and pulls the ball out of your ear. How do you deal with it?
-Accept that he pulled it out of your ear and formulate theories to prove that you are right, basing your life on those theories?
-Refuse to believe he pulled it out of your ear, and formulate theories to refute the existence of any magic, anywhere?
-Ponder the trick, enjoying the show, and live your life happily without defining yourself by the process?
**
The 'vs.' in "Creation Vs. Evolution" requires you have to have some vested interest in the 'correctness' of a particular perspective. An Atheist may argue that they don't believe that the Magician exists at all, but the motivator above is simply 'reality', and the gaps in our model of it.
For biblical literalists, if the literal truth of the Bible doesn't pan out, then they lose their model of reality altogether. The authoritative structure would fall to pieces, since their authority is based upon their interpretation of the Word. For r3fr, the smallest difference in scriptural interpretation turns bloodless 'devotion' into suicide or murder. A great deal hinges on paper, ink and interpretation.
Atheism refuses to accept the *possibility* of a Creator, ignoring the constant revision of the scientific model of reality. Atheistic culture tends to define religion with caricature; Jimmy Swaggart, radical Islam, the Spanish Inquisition, etc, as if any amount of faith makes you susceptible to any abusive extreme. The vain, convoluted idea of "Brights" makes Atheism fashionable. This view ignores the billions of people, "scientists" included, with moderate beliefs that enrich their lives.
A strict adherence to an inflexible model of reality has been a debilitating factor throughout history, both religiously and scientifically. Religious bigotry is no more destructive than intellectual inflexibility; examples pervade the history of science. Today's 'reason' is so often yesterday's intellectual vanity; pig-headedness. Medieval Catholics tortured Jews, Nazi scientists experimented on them with the same results. Their impassive, inflexible, and incorrect model of reality defined them instead of their humanity.
That is my take on it... again. It'll probably get lost about 20 pages from now, and I'll be dippy enough to come back and reiterate it a dozen times, but for now I have devoted too much of my keyboard's longevity to reiteration. Feel free to bash each other over the head with supposition, but please try and see that supposition is what it is all about, even for "Brights".
-Accept that he pulled it out of your ear and formulate theories to prove that you are right, basing your life on those theories?
-Refuse to believe he pulled it out of your ear, and formulate theories to refute the existence of any magic, anywhere?
-Ponder the trick, enjoying the show, and live your life happily without defining yourself by the process?
**
The 'vs.' in "Creation Vs. Evolution" requires you have to have some vested interest in the 'correctness' of a particular perspective. An Atheist may argue that they don't believe that the Magician exists at all, but the motivator above is simply 'reality', and the gaps in our model of it.
For biblical literalists, if the literal truth of the Bible doesn't pan out, then they lose their model of reality altogether. The authoritative structure would fall to pieces, since their authority is based upon their interpretation of the Word. For r3fr, the smallest difference in scriptural interpretation turns bloodless 'devotion' into suicide or murder. A great deal hinges on paper, ink and interpretation.
Atheism refuses to accept the *possibility* of a Creator, ignoring the constant revision of the scientific model of reality. Atheistic culture tends to define religion with caricature; Jimmy Swaggart, radical Islam, the Spanish Inquisition, etc, as if any amount of faith makes you susceptible to any abusive extreme. The vain, convoluted idea of "Brights" makes Atheism fashionable. This view ignores the billions of people, "scientists" included, with moderate beliefs that enrich their lives.
A strict adherence to an inflexible model of reality has been a debilitating factor throughout history, both religiously and scientifically. Religious bigotry is no more destructive than intellectual inflexibility; examples pervade the history of science. Today's 'reason' is so often yesterday's intellectual vanity; pig-headedness. Medieval Catholics tortured Jews, Nazi scientists experimented on them with the same results. Their impassive, inflexible, and incorrect model of reality defined them instead of their humanity.
That is my take on it... again. It'll probably get lost about 20 pages from now, and I'll be dippy enough to come back and reiterate it a dozen times, but for now I have devoted too much of my keyboard's longevity to reiteration. Feel free to bash each other over the head with supposition, but please try and see that supposition is what it is all about, even for "Brights".
BX
Reply #924 Sunday, November 2, 2003 8:53 AM
Reply #924 Sunday, November 2, 2003 8:53 AM
Folks
I read all comments..........actually I believe that God Made Us and Made the whole universe......He Gave us the power to think, to act and to learn......
Let suppose that V R EVOLVED NOT CREATED THEN ONE PROBLEM ARRISED "THE FOSSIL RECORD"
When Darwin put forward his theory, palaeontologists opposed him the most. They knew that the "intermediary transitional forms" which Darwin imagined to have existed, never existed in reality. Darwin was hoping that this problem would be overcome by new fossil findings. Palaeontology, on the contrary, invalidated Darwin's theory more and more each day.
Take a look at this great site for answering the questions and querries
http://www.harunyahya.com
I read all comments..........actually I believe that God Made Us and Made the whole universe......He Gave us the power to think, to act and to learn......
Let suppose that V R EVOLVED NOT CREATED THEN ONE PROBLEM ARRISED "THE FOSSIL RECORD"
When Darwin put forward his theory, palaeontologists opposed him the most. They knew that the "intermediary transitional forms" which Darwin imagined to have existed, never existed in reality. Darwin was hoping that this problem would be overcome by new fossil findings. Palaeontology, on the contrary, invalidated Darwin's theory more and more each day.
Take a look at this great site for answering the questions and querries
http://www.harunyahya.com
BX
Reply #925 Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:03 AM
Reply #925 Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:03 AM
IF EVLUATION IS FACT then why humen have same 2 hands, 2 foot, one head and 2 eyez.......y they have not "evolved" into something else with 2 heads or wings or something like this
EVALUATION.........has it finished........or??????
EVALUATION.........has it finished........or??????
kona0197
Reply #926 Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:22 AM
Mormons added on to the bible with the book of Mormon. It is stated in Revelation that this is a a big no-no.
Any religion that believes in babtism for the dead and 3 different heavens and the fact you can rule your own planet (as a god) is not for me.
I used to dabble in the mormon church. My wife used to be a mormon until I pulled her out of it.
Mormonism is a cult.
Reply #926 Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:22 AM
| Just curious, but what makes you think we're a cult? |
Mormons added on to the bible with the book of Mormon. It is stated in Revelation that this is a a big no-no.
Any religion that believes in babtism for the dead and 3 different heavens and the fact you can rule your own planet (as a god) is not for me.
I used to dabble in the mormon church. My wife used to be a mormon until I pulled her out of it.
Mormonism is a cult.
The Rated PG
Reply #927 Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:58 AM
Reply #927 Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:58 AM
In addition Kona there are whole chapters plagerized in the mormon book. I'm not talking here there could be same story different people. Plagerized even to the punctuation placement(periods, quotations, etc) of the 1611 version of the king James Bible). Copyright violation? Modern day copy/paste. 
grayhaze
Reply #928 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:32 AM
Okay, I give in. Your mere existance conclusively disproves evolution.
Reply #928 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:32 AM
| #925 by Mr ^^Arkantos^^ - 11/2/2003 10:03:59 AM IF EVLUATION IS FACT then why humen have same 2 hands, 2 foot, one head and 2 eyez.......y they have not "evolved" into something else with 2 heads or wings or something like thisEVALUATION.........has it finished........or?????? |
Okay, I give in. Your mere existance conclusively disproves evolution.
Doreen
Reply #929 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:37 AM
Reply #929 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:37 AM
I don't "think" that any of the diff Religions are cults they are simply searching for God and maybe still lost.
God is not a Religion...
God is not a Religion...
Doreen
Reply #930 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:38 AM
Reply #930 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:38 AM
course I won't know "exactly" anything until I die either... hehe 
Ryan1598
Reply #931 Sunday, November 2, 2003 3:12 PM
What is so wrong with the concept of 'stopping', to be non-existent? I believe that something gave me this incredible gift to be on this earth (for whatever purpose is completely beyond me). I can't emphasize how much of a gift it is. I don’t feel like I should be rewarded for receiving such a gift (by rewarded, I mean going to “heaven”) In fact I hope I cease to exist, just like any other ending.
Reply #931 Sunday, November 2, 2003 3:12 PM
| Just like Braniac said, it would be pretty crappy if all you get is the 80 or so years you are alive on this planet. My guess is that's exactly how it is, no after-life, no heaven, no hell...just the end. |
What is so wrong with the concept of 'stopping', to be non-existent? I believe that something gave me this incredible gift to be on this earth (for whatever purpose is completely beyond me). I can't emphasize how much of a gift it is. I don’t feel like I should be rewarded for receiving such a gift (by rewarded, I mean going to “heaven”) In fact I hope I cease to exist, just like any other ending.
r3fr
Reply #933 Sunday, November 2, 2003 6:19 PM
Faith. We believe its the right choice. You can call our decision whatever you please, but its our decision.
JWs were also persecuted by the Nazis, suffering the same results as the Jews, we were also persecuted greatly in the 50s, and are today in the Republic of Georgia. Some of the things they done to JWs (Purple Triangle) and Jews (Yellow star I think), and Polish were simply horrible. Killing parents in front of their children, gas chaimbers, torture and the list as we know, goes on. All for Hitler and for his 'perfect race.'
But... i'm not Mormon. Catholics have done the same too. I'm not sure the 'scripture,' but they made up a verse saying that the Father, Son, and holy spirit are one being. Of course they're not which I explained earlier, but they did it to make their beliefs seem true.
Yeah, but I don't believe any of that. I think that they also believe that all people go to heaven (to different planets too), wherein the Bible it says the wicked will be destroyed. Though I could be wrong about that belief.
No, not true. One example is the incident of Haley's comet. A group of people thought that God was behind this comet or something, and so they [gruesome] cut off body parts and killed themselfs [/gruesome]. Yeah, they were cultists. Heaven's Gate suicide is what it was.
We both know that you don't want to die. Nobody really wants to die. Even people who've attempted suicide didn't/don't want to die. We all have the will to live. To be happy. We're built to live forever, whether by evolution or creation, but somehow we die. Some say survival of the fittest, others say imperfection (oh oh, me me!). If it were survival of the fittest, how did Bill Gates get here?!? Just kidding, I like Windows... Its fast, reliable, and effective. And, if you call now, you'll get a free 'Blue Death' screen saver. Sorry. (Actually i've never gotten one of those on Windows XP.)
The Bible teaches that there are 3 places people will eventually end up. 1, heaven, but only 144,000 (kings and priests. Revelation 7:4; 14:1, 3; 20:6). 2, life on a paradise earth for a great crowd, which was Gods original purpose. (Revelation 7:9; Isaiah 11:6-9 notice too that animals will feed on straw, not in heaven, but on earth; Psalm 104:5; Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 45:18; Matthew 6:10, 33; Isaiah 55:11; Psalm 37:9-11, 29; Matthew 5:5; also, to show that this time is drawing near: “the sign” of “the last days.” Matthew 24:3-14; 2 Timothy 3:1-5; also the destruction of false religion (Great Harlet) by the nations will be a sign as well and the true religion will stand.) 3, eternal destruction, NOT, eternal torture. (Psalm 37:10; Job 24:24; Psalm 68:2; 146:4).
Reply #933 Sunday, November 2, 2003 6:19 PM
| For r3fr, the smallest difference in scriptural interpretation turns bloodless 'devotion' into suicide or murder. A great deal hinges on paper, ink and interpretation. |
Faith. We believe its the right choice. You can call our decision whatever you please, but its our decision.
| Nazi scientists experimented on them with the same results. Their impassive, inflexible, and incorrect model of reality defined them instead of their humanity. |
JWs were also persecuted by the Nazis, suffering the same results as the Jews, we were also persecuted greatly in the 50s, and are today in the Republic of Georgia. Some of the things they done to JWs (Purple Triangle) and Jews (Yellow star I think), and Polish were simply horrible. Killing parents in front of their children, gas chaimbers, torture and the list as we know, goes on. All for Hitler and for his 'perfect race.'
| Mormons added on to the bible with the book of Mormon. It is stated in Revelation that this is a a big no-no. |
But... i'm not Mormon. Catholics have done the same too. I'm not sure the 'scripture,' but they made up a verse saying that the Father, Son, and holy spirit are one being. Of course they're not which I explained earlier, but they did it to make their beliefs seem true.
| Any religion that believes in babtism for the dead and 3 different heavens and the fact you can rule your own planet (as a god) is not for me. I used to dabble in the mormon church. My wife used to be a mormon until I pulled her out of it. Mormonism is a cult. |
Yeah, but I don't believe any of that. I think that they also believe that all people go to heaven (to different planets too), wherein the Bible it says the wicked will be destroyed. Though I could be wrong about that belief.
| I don't "think" that any of the diff Religions are cults they are simply searching for God and maybe still lost. God is not a Religion... |
No, not true. One example is the incident of Haley's comet. A group of people thought that God was behind this comet or something, and so they [gruesome] cut off body parts and killed themselfs [/gruesome]. Yeah, they were cultists. Heaven's Gate suicide is what it was.
| What is so wrong with the concept of 'stopping', to be non-existent? I believe that something gave me this incredible gift to be on this earth (for whatever purpose is completely beyond me). I can't emphasize how much of a gift it is. I don’t feel like I should be rewarded for receiving such a gift (by rewarded, I mean going to “heaven”) In fact I hope I cease to exist, just like any other ending. |
We both know that you don't want to die. Nobody really wants to die. Even people who've attempted suicide didn't/don't want to die. We all have the will to live. To be happy. We're built to live forever, whether by evolution or creation, but somehow we die. Some say survival of the fittest, others say imperfection (oh oh, me me!). If it were survival of the fittest, how did Bill Gates get here?!? Just kidding, I like Windows... Its fast, reliable, and effective. And, if you call now, you'll get a free 'Blue Death' screen saver. Sorry. (Actually i've never gotten one of those on Windows XP.)
The Bible teaches that there are 3 places people will eventually end up. 1, heaven, but only 144,000 (kings and priests. Revelation 7:4; 14:1, 3; 20:6). 2, life on a paradise earth for a great crowd, which was Gods original purpose. (Revelation 7:9; Isaiah 11:6-9 notice too that animals will feed on straw, not in heaven, but on earth; Psalm 104:5; Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 45:18; Matthew 6:10, 33; Isaiah 55:11; Psalm 37:9-11, 29; Matthew 5:5; also, to show that this time is drawing near: “the sign” of “the last days.” Matthew 24:3-14; 2 Timothy 3:1-5; also the destruction of false religion (Great Harlet) by the nations will be a sign as well and the true religion will stand.) 3, eternal destruction, NOT, eternal torture. (Psalm 37:10; Job 24:24; Psalm 68:2; 146:4).
kona0197
Reply #934 Sunday, November 2, 2003 6:45 PM
Ah but if you give me a few days I can dig up some verses out of the bible that say the trinty is believeable.
Reply #934 Sunday, November 2, 2003 6:45 PM
| But... i'm not Mormon. Catholics have done the same too. I'm not sure the 'scripture,' but they made up a verse saying that the Father, Son, and holy spirit are one being. Of course they're not which I explained earlier, but they did it to make their beliefs seem true. |
Ah but if you give me a few days I can dig up some verses out of the bible that say the trinty is believeable.
Doreen
Reply #935 Sunday, November 2, 2003 9:29 PM
Reply #935 Sunday, November 2, 2003 9:29 PM
No, not true. One example is the incident of Haley's comet. A group of people thought that God was behind this comet or something, and so they [gruesome] cut off body parts and killed themselfs [/gruesome]. Yeah, they were cultists. Heaven's Gate suicide is what it was.
#933 by Citizen r3fr - 11/2/2003 6:19:14 PM
anddd I still stand by what I said:
they are simply searching for God and maybe still lost...
#933 by Citizen r3fr - 11/2/2003 6:19:14 PM
anddd I still stand by what I said:
they are simply searching for God and maybe still lost...
r3fr
Reply #936 Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:43 PM
OK, but you haven't answered why you think JWs are a cult. You don't have to though, I was just curious and I though that i'd clear up any misunderstandings if any.
Well, no, they're dead. They killed themselfs. One definition of the word 'cult' is
"A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader."
Reply #936 Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:43 PM
| Ah but if you give me a few days I can dig up some verses out of the bible that say the trinty is believeable. |
OK, but you haven't answered why you think JWs are a cult. You don't have to though, I was just curious and I though that i'd clear up any misunderstandings if any.
| anddd I still stand by what I said: they are simply searching for God and maybe still lost... |
Well, no, they're dead. They killed themselfs. One definition of the word 'cult' is
"A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader."
EventHorizon
Reply #937 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:00 PM
They have?
Reply #937 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:00 PM
| Catholics have done the same too (added books to the bible) |
They have?
joetheblow
Reply #938 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:17 PM
Reply #938 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:17 PM
Hey Bakerstreet, I truely enjoy reading your posts so I hope you post again even though it is the same thing.
It also helps that I agree with what your saying... but even if I didn't you write very well.
----------------------
So, no one thinks we will have an extra finger a few thousand years from now because of that Dominate gene?
In the end its all about different points of view. Reading comprehension, human error and others will always be the bane of the truth.
GI Joe has Cobra
Superman has Doomsday
Batman has... Bane
Banking has Investment Fraud
Sugar has Spice
The list goes on...
So for those who totally believe in Creation or Evolution you have never thought that what you believe in could be wrong? Or for that matter, can only be an assumption not a ultimate truth?
I think I used this earier in this thread:
I assume my Mercedes Benz McLaren is outside. No reason to think otherwise but does it really have to be?
It also helps that I agree with what your saying... but even if I didn't you write very well.
----------------------
So, no one thinks we will have an extra finger a few thousand years from now because of that Dominate gene?
In the end its all about different points of view. Reading comprehension, human error and others will always be the bane of the truth.
GI Joe has Cobra
Superman has Doomsday
Batman has... Bane
Banking has Investment Fraud
Sugar has Spice
The list goes on...
So for those who totally believe in Creation or Evolution you have never thought that what you believe in could be wrong? Or for that matter, can only be an assumption not a ultimate truth?
I think I used this earier in this thread:
I assume my Mercedes Benz McLaren is outside. No reason to think otherwise but does it really have to be?
joetheblow
Reply #939 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:18 PM
I have heard that but never investigated it.
Reply #939 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:18 PM
| #937 by EventHorizon - 11/2/2003 11:00:59 PM Catholics have done the same too (added books to the bible)They have? |
I have heard that but never investigated it.
kona0197
Reply #940 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:31 PM
I would have to look into JW before I say anything further.
Only reason I said anything about mormons is because my wife was one and I was one too.
Been there, done that.
No misunderstandings...
Reply #940 Sunday, November 2, 2003 11:31 PM
| OK, but you haven't answered why you think JWs are a cult. You don't have to though, I was just curious and I though that i'd clear up any misunderstandings if any. |
I would have to look into JW before I say anything further.
Only reason I said anything about mormons is because my wife was one and I was one too.
Been there, done that.
No misunderstandings...
Please login to comment and/or vote for this skin.
Welcome Guest! Please take the time to register with us.
There are many great features available to you once you register, including:
- Richer content, access to many features that are disabled for guests like commenting on the forums and downloading skins.
- Access to a great community, with a massive database of many, many areas of interest.
- Access to contests & subscription offers like exclusive emails.
- It's simple, and FREE!
|
|
Page 47 of 56 | |
|
|---|
Reply #921 Sunday, November 2, 2003 3:39 AM
I here the carrier gene for human hands if 6 fingers while 5 fingers is the 'supressive gene'
I got that from 5th grade science class 12 years ago
So is it true? We will 'evolve' and the dominant gene will give us 6 finger hands?