WinCustomize needs a new calculator.
Monday, June 2, 2003 by Apocalypse_67 | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
Is it just me or has anyone noticed how the numbers on the download lists never match the other lists?
I did a check on my total downloads and it added up to 4079, yet the number on the Top list is 3770. The other night my total downloads was 4018 and on the list went up to 5400. Kind of confusing, dont you all think?
Are any of this numbers real, or the site counter is just trowing numbers for the hell of it? If this is the case, then why have a download count?
I did a check on my total downloads and it added up to 4079, yet the number on the Top list is 3770. The other night my total downloads was 4018 and on the list went up to 5400. Kind of confusing, dont you all think?
Are any of this numbers real, or the site counter is just trowing numbers for the hell of it? If this is the case, then why have a download count?
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MadIce
Reply #42 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:05 AM
Reply #42 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:05 AM
Adni18:
Looks like you once again imply intentional misconduct. You should not do that. Why should you. You have nothing to fear, don't you?
BTW, Adni18. The fact that you do not know how to cheat should make you feel better. It just means you are likely not to be one of those who do. I am a programmer and can imagine several ways to cheat without much fuzz. So, it is a good idea that those gaps are closed. If I can dream them up, so can others.
| You said "For you to make that statement is rediculous since you have no idea as to what goes on behind the scenes", well maybe I do, it needs only a common sense to understand what is going on. |
Looks like you once again imply intentional misconduct. You should not do that. Why should you. You have nothing to fear, don't you?
BTW, Adni18. The fact that you do not know how to cheat should make you feel better. It just means you are likely not to be one of those who do. I am a programmer and can imagine several ways to cheat without much fuzz. So, it is a good idea that those gaps are closed. If I can dream them up, so can others.
MadIce
Reply #43 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:06 AM
Reply #43 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:06 AM
| Can we expect a Greatest Hits album soon? I can imagine such classics as 'Don't let the bad skinners cheat' and 'Is that a RIP??' to be on there... |
BoXXi
Reply #45 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:12 AM
Reply #45 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:12 AM
| Nobody can cheat the system, unless he is an admin |
We can't cheat the system any more than any other person can. Yet another ridiculous accusation aimed at the people who are trying to protect you and make the place fairer for everyone. You people make me laugh sometimes.
adni18
Reply #46 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:12 AM
Reply #46 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:12 AM
Hey MadIce,
Have I wrote anything with capitals to look upset? I was just asking.
There are no evil skinners and none of them is stealing anything, they just offering! Am I wrong?
I have to say that someone must be brave to post in the Message Board, he or she, is in great danger to be accused, if you know what I mean.
Have I wrote anything with capitals to look upset? I was just asking.
There are no evil skinners and none of them is stealing anything, they just offering! Am I wrong?
I have to say that someone must be brave to post in the Message Board, he or she, is in great danger to be accused, if you know what I mean.
Fuzzy Logic
Reply #47 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:18 AM
Reply #47 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:18 AM
This bickering is pointless. The original system was open to abuse, the new system only counts a fraction of total downloads. Somewhere along the line someone is going to be unhappy. So either live with the new system or ignore it. It's certainly not worth getting worked up about.
Fuzzy Logic thinks skinning should be about skinning not points scoring
Fuzzy Logic thinks skinning should be about skinning not points scoring
Lecrayon
Reply #48 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:21 AM
Reply #48 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:21 AM
I think that if you log-on a cookie is placed. I never logoff...So when I go to the site I am automatically logged on....Now, when you start your downloadslurper and your skincountcookiedeleter in a sequelbatch you just have to sit back and relax.... 
Just a wild guess...
Just a wild guess...
citats
Reply #49 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:33 AM
This makes perfect sense...
yes, no?
Reply #49 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:33 AM
| #33 by jebland - 6/3/2003 8:47:02 AM Why not require a user to log-in to download? A lot of sites require this. |
This makes perfect sense...
yes, no?
MadIce
Reply #50 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:35 AM
There are several ways to cheat. Most of them look innocent. And lets hope they are innocent and are not intended to cheat. It is more or less the same as updating skins and walls to get a skinner in the "Newest addition list". People in that list have a slight advantage over others. It will influence the top author list. Of course you have never used it that way, but it gives you an idea how easy it is to manipulate the downloads.
Reply #50 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:35 AM
| There are no evil skinners and none of them is stealing anything, they just offering! Am I wrong? |
There are several ways to cheat. Most of them look innocent. And lets hope they are innocent and are not intended to cheat. It is more or less the same as updating skins and walls to get a skinner in the "Newest addition list". People in that list have a slight advantage over others. It will influence the top author list. Of course you have never used it that way, but it gives you an idea how easy it is to manipulate the downloads.
eieio
Reply #51 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:35 AM
Reply #51 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:35 AM
It does to me, §tatic 
Hopefully, some others will respond.
Hopefully, some others will respond.
paxx
Reply #52 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:40 AM
Reply #52 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:40 AM
Adni, I'm not going to start to list them because I don't want to give anybody any idea, but there are indeed many ways to cheat the system to increase the download count if you're not logged in.
paxx
Reply #53 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:43 AM
Reply #53 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:43 AM
pict: the problem is that if we do that downloads will cut by dramatically. Most people would never bother signing up an account and would just go somewhere else. You're probably looking at getting around 25% of the downloads, at the most optimistic estimate.
jcg
Reply #54 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:44 AM
adni,
That is a trend I've noticed but I think its because there has been an unnatural number of posts recently that are accusatory in nature and directed at the admins or at least directed at some of the things they are trying to do. In many cases I think its a natural defensive response.
Everyone's nerves are becoming a little raw and I think it would do everyone good to step back and just let the admins do their job. If then there is evidence of abuse, hank-panky or whatever that is the time to make the case. It is unfair to suggest abuse or unfairness before the system is given a chance.
But it is easy to log off, delete the cookie, and return unnoticed. I never log off either, but I have some idea how the mechanism works, I've had enough HD crashes to know.
Reply #54 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:44 AM
| I have to say that someone must be brave to post in the Message Board, he or she, is in great danger to be accused, if you know what I mean. |
adni,
That is a trend I've noticed but I think its because there has been an unnatural number of posts recently that are accusatory in nature and directed at the admins or at least directed at some of the things they are trying to do. In many cases I think its a natural defensive response.
Everyone's nerves are becoming a little raw and I think it would do everyone good to step back and just let the admins do their job. If then there is evidence of abuse, hank-panky or whatever that is the time to make the case. It is unfair to suggest abuse or unfairness before the system is given a chance.
| I think that if you log-on a cookie is placed. I never logoff...So when I go to the site I am automatically logged on.... |
But it is easy to log off, delete the cookie, and return unnoticed. I never log off either, but I have some idea how the mechanism works, I've had enough HD crashes to know.
eieio
Reply #55 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 12:09 PM
Reply #55 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 12:09 PM
paxx,
Good point. I think you're right in that some people (maybe even the majority) who don't login would not register in order to be able to download. But if the logged in only downloads are the only one's that matter as far as top counts go, they shouldn't decrease. It's likely they would increase slightly as some folks would register in order to be able to download the great skins, etc.
I'm just thinking it would even the counts. In other words, there wouldn't be a raw and WC count, they would all be WC counts and people could stop the speculation and arguing and so forth and get back to skinning and all the other good things this community provides.
Good point. I think you're right in that some people (maybe even the majority) who don't login would not register in order to be able to download. But if the logged in only downloads are the only one's that matter as far as top counts go, they shouldn't decrease. It's likely they would increase slightly as some folks would register in order to be able to download the great skins, etc.
I'm just thinking it would even the counts. In other words, there wouldn't be a raw and WC count, they would all be WC counts and people could stop the speculation and arguing and so forth and get back to skinning and all the other good things this community provides.
adni18
Reply #56 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 12:37 PM
Reply #56 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 12:37 PM
#55 by pictoratus,
"In other words, there wouldn't be a raw and WC count, they would all be WC counts and people could stop the speculation and arguing and so forth and get back to skinning and all the other good things this community provides."
I think this is a great idea, simple and clear!
"In other words, there wouldn't be a raw and WC count, they would all be WC counts and people could stop the speculation and arguing and so forth and get back to skinning and all the other good things this community provides."
I think this is a great idea, simple and clear!
Apocalypse_67
Reply #57 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 12:51 PM
Reply #57 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 12:51 PM
I gotta agree with Pictoratus. Everyone can view this website, since its public, but if management was to force people to login in order to download, I think it will eliminate all this confusing ways of couting downloads and there wont be any need to keep a hidden list of WC downloads. In return, this will also eliminate all this speculations and arguments. I think this will be great for the site aswell as for the authors and members.
After all, visitors can only download 5mb (wich is about 2 wallpapers and a skin) before they are force to create an account, So I really dont see any harm in making the downloads only for login members, as a matter of fact, i think it will encourage more people to log on and create accounts.
[Message Edited]
After all, visitors can only download 5mb (wich is about 2 wallpapers and a skin) before they are force to create an account, So I really dont see any harm in making the downloads only for login members, as a matter of fact, i think it will encourage more people to log on and create accounts.
[Message Edited]
T-Man
Reply #58 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 1:10 PM
Reply #58 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 1:10 PM
Personally we do not want to require people to create accounts in order to download skins. Only after bandwidth and costs became an issue did we start requiring accounts after x number of bytes downloaded. We really did not want to do that but it became a necessity.
In has been our position that we want new comers to the site to be able to freely navigate and try out skins without having to jump through the necessary hoops of creating accounts.
Can you imagine how many accounts we would have now. Instead of 600,000 plus it would probably be more like 20,000,000 accounts. We would be storing information for people who will most likely never come back. Then that opens up another can of worms.
The suggestion is appreciated but is not practical and goes against some of the ideals that we are trying to put forth.
eieio
Reply #59 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 1:25 PM
Reply #59 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 1:25 PM
T-man
Thanks for responding to this. This, in my opinion, is the way it should work. Regular people have ideas, make suggestions, etc. and the admins respond in a logical coherent way.
Hopefully, we can see more of this kind of discourse on this board.
Maybe there is some debate about how many people would sign up (I tend to agree with paxx) but at least we're talking about it in a civized manner.
Thanks for responding to this. This, in my opinion, is the way it should work. Regular people have ideas, make suggestions, etc. and the admins respond in a logical coherent way.
Hopefully, we can see more of this kind of discourse on this board.
Maybe there is some debate about how many people would sign up (I tend to agree with paxx) but at least we're talking about it in a civized manner.
adni18
Reply #60 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 1:42 PM
Reply #60 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 1:42 PM
I have to agree with #58 by Janitor T-Man , it is another point of view and very reasonable.
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Reply #41 Tuesday, June 3, 2003 11:05 AM
T-man and the Admins (sounds like a 60s pop group)
Can we expect a Greatest Hits album soon? I can imagine such classics as 'Don't let the bad skinners cheat' and 'Is that a RIP??' to be on there...