I'm pissed
Saturday, May 18, 2002 by davad70 | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
1. Why is it that lately this site seems to be disregarding the wishes of skinners more and more often? The majority of skinners, as well as many of the wizops/admins who are actually skinners, want to scrap the rating system. Do the wishes and requests of skinners matter to the people who run this site on this issue? Apparently not. I’ve also not come across a skinner who thinks that the libraries should be sorted by the date they were updated, but now they are. It was decided a ways back that the fair thing to do was to sort the libraries by create date. Now with the launch of WC2, we are back to sorting libraries by date of update. Why? Because Frogboy wants it that way. It doesn’t matter that most of the skinners want it another way. Frogboy wants…Frogboy gets.
2. We hear quite a lot about the heavy burden that Wincustomize has placed upon Stardock. We also hear quite a bit about how popular WC has become in the past year. I’m curious as to why this site has become so popular. Personally I think it’s popularity is mostly due to the fact that people can get skins from some of the best skinners in the world here, who give their skins freely. We also hear a lot about the fact that Wc needs to be able to support itself, and not be funded directly by Stardock. Yet it seems that Stardock will always be in control of this site and that it will never truly be a “community site”. So I ask, why shouldn’t Stardock pay for this site? It seems to me that this site is the greatest marketing tool that Stardock has. I would think that people buy Windowblinds and the other programs to be able to use the skins that they see on this site. So with the advent of the subscriber program what benefits do skinners get? Ummm, we get unlimited downloads just as we always have before. BTW, that’s the same benefit that OD (which I am also) users get also. So, the fact that I’ve submitted 15 skins since the first of the year gets me nothing. My contribution is apparently not better than Joe Blow downloader who paid $20. Joe Blow gets the skin browser, “exclusive suites”, etc. I get nothing but the privilege of downloading my skins as much as I want. J
3. Now to the issue that’s really got me pissed off to the degree that I finally am fed up. Anyone remember the GUI Olympics? Anyone remember the prizes that Frogboy stated that Honorable mention winners would receive? Let me refresh your memory. Anyone who picked up an honorable mention will get a free copy of Object Desktop (or a renewal), an Object Desktop sweat shirt, a T-shirt, a LWNinja T-shirt and some other goodies. Those who won multiple honorable mentions will be given additional Object Desktop renewals. posted by Lord Frogboy - 4/2/2002 1:07:58 PM. Well, I won an honorable mention and didn’t receive anything until I contacted them. They just forgot about me. That was no big deal to me, sometimes thing like that happen. So I got an email saying that my OD subscription was renewed and it was. Great right? Well, I waited about 2 weeks to get the other goodies that I had coming. Still didn’t get them, so I write back to ask when I would be getting all the other stuff. Basically I was told that they changed their mind and were not sending out any of the actual physical prizes. I then contacted some other skinners who won honorable mentions to see if they got their prizes. They all got their OD renewals, but no one got any of the other prizes for honorable mention prizes. After emailing Brad back he tells me that I should have gotten those other prizes (yes, I know that), and that he’ll check with the person who sent out the prizes to see whats going on. This is the same person that told me that there weren’t going to be any physical prizes given out for honorable mentions. Sounds very odd to me.
So….am I overreacting, or do I have a right to be a tad pissed?
Reply #142 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 7:06 PM
I also enjoyed the GUI Olympics immensely, as I think I stated way back at the start of this thread. Sure there were a lot of initial problems with the rules and such, but I think the way Brad listened to what myself and the rest of the hotheads had to say, and the way he acted quickly to do something about our concerns, was above and beyond what could be expected.
My dissent only comes in relation to promises unfulfilled and important questions left unanswered. I also sometimes feel, perhaps unjustly, that skinners are slightly undervalued here when compared to other community sites. That's just my opinion though, and I know there are many who disagree.
Reply #143 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 7:20 PM
Reading all this lot has given me a ****in' headache so I'm going to bed now (it's 00:18 here).
Night all!
Reply #144 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 7:29 PM
For example, who should win "Skinner of the year"? Talk about a real killer: Do you award Treetog? Well, Treetog's an admin here. So is Alexandrie. So is DavidK and Paxx and Jafo and other skinners. Do you award Adni? His skins have the most downloads. But how does one determine best skins? So you can see the problems we're having. I think the Gooeys will have to become a Stardock-specific event so that we can at least look at giving awards to people who happen to be admins on this site.
Regarding the GUI Olympics, while I was indeed ticked off when I said I wouldn't do another one, now with a calm view on things I still don't think it a good thing(tm) for me to volunteer for it. I'm too much of a target. And any future one would have to be pretty much run by Stardock with no ambiguity as something that primarily is targeting skin users and then have specific awards for skin sites as a seperate thing. Like I said before, it's really a problem mixing altruism with business because people can't easily see where one part stops and the other starts.
Phew!

Reply #145 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 7:29 PM
Reply #146 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 7:33 PM
Reply #147 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 7:40 PM
While it remains the case that the majority of admins/wizops are skinners themselves then skinners will be very much 'valued'. We ain't about to cut off our noses to spite our faces...

Some people seem to overstate Brad's and Stardock's control of Mincustomize.com to the detriment of the other admins/wizops actual influence over the site management and direction.
We really are a skinner-controlled site...it's just that the 'Accountant' [Brad], although a skinner as well, needs to be a realist as well. It ain't all gonna be fun and games....someone has to buy the playground equipment and maintain it...

I still believe that the majority of flak that Wincustomize seems to generate and/or attract is a direct result of a more 'open' management interaction/inclusion with the skinners and general users themselves....

Reply #150 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 7:52 PM
). Even though the odds of me ever creating a single skin that would ever see the light of day is slim to none I will continue to support this site and Pixtudio with my wallet. I think that most of this is no more than folks not taking a couple of moments to actualy listen (read) to each other. If you don't want to help keep this site around, fine, don't support it! >
I'm sure that there are a large number of us evil USERS that will. Please don't get me wrong, I will allways thank the ARTists who make each and every skin that gets uploaded. Without them my Puters would be very very gray. I allso think that Brad is taking the honerable path and sending out all of the goodies to the folks who got the Honorable mentions during the winter GUI Olympics, yes wires got crossed but in the end I think that most of the miscommunications have been resolved.
As far as the ratings go, I have my account set to display every skin with a "1" or higher just in case some DWEEB gave a gem of a skin a low score. I comment on those that I like or if I notice a problem. Do I rate every skin that I look at .... Nope.
Well enough of my ravings, have a great evening all, and please try and take a moment to listen to each other.
Grog goes back to the basement to go get a Beer or two or three

Reply #151 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 7:56 PM
Reply #152 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 8:20 PM
by Janitor T-Man - 5/21/2002 10:39:50 AM
Apparently you really haven't noticed us skinner's T-Man. We've been offering suggestions and compromises regarding the rating system for the last 6 months, only to seemingly be ignored each time.
Similarly, I see too many skinners behaving as if we admins are their servants or something. I see too many users treating us as tech support people.
The smearing of volunteers is really ironic because it usually comes from the most anti-corporate-involvement crowd.
I'm not aware of anyone here either taking the admins for granted or "smearing" any of them.
Regarding the extra goodies: They were being sent out presently. While the rules implied that it was an (get one of these items) it's probably best to just send out goodies. Davad should already have his now.
Brad if it was not your intent to give out these prizes then you shouldn't have. I don't want anything that's not owed to me.
I'll quote from your emails;
Yea, you should have received them.
Indeed. Alexandrie told me today that she never received hers. Nobody but you ever mentioned it to me.
Obviously these comments, along with your posts regarding the prizes, make it appear to me that you intended to give those "goodies" out as prizes from the beginning, and didn't understand why we hadn't gotten them. It was just forgotten, just like my OD subscription.
Ok, I'm definitely done with the topic of "the goodies". I just don't you making it sound as if you did me a favor by sending out the prizes.
Reply #153 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 8:23 PM

Reply #154 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 8:35 PM
all sat down in one boat together...
troubled voyage in calm weather...
listen to Jafo – for the most part we are all skinners running this site.
The decisions made are almost always a debated consensus which always takes all the message board conversation into account. Everyone has a voice and the overall reality is you can post your stuff, speak your mind, download some goodies, take part/not take part, support/not support, whatever you want! It's all here for *you*... and we're glad you're here... so there...

Reply #155 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 9:01 PM
Reply #156 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 11:46 PM
Out of curiousity, how much does stardock pay for bandwidth? I've got a T1 at home that costs me about $450/month. I can't imagine that a T1 would handle all your bandwidth needs, but surely 2-3 of them would. Where does the extra $140,000/year in running expenses come from?
Just wondering.
Reply #157 Wednesday, May 22, 2002 1:50 AM
I'll leave it to Frogboy to give you an indication of the scale of this site, but you need to add a bit for paid coding time for the site, which is apart from the size of the pipe...

Reply #158 Wednesday, May 22, 2002 3:25 AM
Now did I see someone use the word "get" in conjunction with my name?
Reply #159 Wednesday, May 22, 2002 8:40 AM
Reply #160 Wednesday, May 22, 2002 9:08 AM
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Reply #141 Tuesday, May 21, 2002 6:58 PM