Help with Object Bar

Wednesday, November 21, 2001 by starone | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk

I don't have WinXP, but I seem to be able to create the XP Bar, however I am having a problem with the Menu. I get the bottom, right, left and top okay, but the menu comes up as the windows menu and can't seem to get the WinXP bottom, right, left and top menu to come up instead. What am I doing wrong? Thanks for your help.
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feline
Reply #1 Wednesday, November 21, 2001 11:54 AM
are you using the public demo or have you got OB via object desktop?

i have heard that the demo only allowes you to use the 3 skins that came with the demo.

however, i would expect one of those to be an XP look bar. the object desktop 0.70 version of OB comes with XP bars in several colours, all of which work fine for me.

it sounds like you are trying to create a bar, while if all you want is the XP look many suitable bars already exist. try the OB section here
starone
Reply #2 Wednesday, November 21, 2001 12:10 PM
I am trying to create the XP menu look. I have the full desktop version. I want to create my own menu, but can't seem to get the top, right, left and bottom of it to come up. Just the old windows menu look. Don't want to replicate someone else's work. I have the graphics done and everything in place. Don't know what I need to tell Object Bar to get it to come up.

By the way, thanks for replying.
feline
Reply #3 Wednesday, November 21, 2001 12:53 PM
how brave are you feeling?

one plan would be to open the skin defintion file in notepad (or preferably gvim *evil g*) and then simply replace the names of the graphics on an existing XP like skin with your new graphics.

having a look at the files in my:
c:\program files\object desktop\objectbar\winxp\bars
directory suggests that there is one *.obbar file per part of the start bar, and that the start menu is composed out of 5 component bars.

from what you are describing i would guess that you either havent created these sub-bars, or else havent got OB to load them correctly.

since i have yet to attempt skinning OB i am just making educated guesses here, so this isnt gospal

the easier plan is probably to download (if you havent already) SkinStudio 1.20 (via object desktop), if you have a subscription, since i beleive this now supports OB as well as windowblinds.

hope this helps
starone
Reply #4 Wednesday, November 21, 2001 4:45 PM
Thanks, you have been very helpful. I believe the problem is that I haven't been able to get Object Bar to load them correctly (I'm sure it is my error and not Object Bar). I am in the process of renaming the graphics files with mine (tedious). I was hoping that I could find out what I needed to tell Object Bar to get them to load correctly. Looks a little strange with an XP bar and a windows menu. Thought about settling, but my drive of not succeeding and finding out why keeps me going. Guess I'm a hopeless case. Been trying to figure it out for about 4 days now. Guess you could call that either stupid or driven, huh?

You mentioned the start menu. The ones I have looked at I believe contains a windows start and a start settings. Is the start settings the XP version I wonder? Can't tell any difference if I load an XP look alike from the one I have done. I guess that's what has got me confused.

Again, thanks for your help. It is much appreciated. After I get this thing going, I can finally go about perfecting the graphics part.
starone
Reply #5 Wednesday, November 21, 2001 5:34 PM
Went back and looked at my coding and had one of the bars wrong. Duh! It works except for one flaw. Everything is in the proper place except for the right panel which appears above the top panel and not in its proper place. (Ever have one of those weeks?). Now have to figure out why. Got to thinking about the 5 bars you mentioned and the light finally went off. Thanks a heap!
feline
Reply #6 Thursday, November 22, 2001 9:47 AM
looking at my "WinXP StartPanel - Left.obbar" file, in the [Object] section there are some values that sound like positions.

specifically:
LastPos.x=0
LastPos.y=618
LastSize.cx=176
LastSize.cy=336
ptLastScreenSize.x=800
ptLastScreenSize.y=600

so, it may be worth playing with these numbers on you sub-bars, to see if they really are what they sound like

i would experiment here, but i dont like the XP start menu, and OB seems to be pushing my machine over the edge, so i am having to do without for now *sigh*

one of those weeks???
i take it you havent read the "one of those days" thread then
starone
Reply #7 Thursday, November 22, 2001 5:20 PM
Read your one of those days threads. Sounds tough. At least there is always light at the end of the tunnel, especially when you have others helping you. You have been really great taking the time to help. I really do appreciate it.

I know what you mean about the machine being taxed. Before they perfected WB3, a lot of my programs kept zinking out. Since the latest download of WB3, everthing seems to be working fine. I can now load all my grapic pieces and work from there. Before I was lucky if I got through two revisions before the graphics program crashed.

I also know what you mean about not being to crazy about the XP Start menu. I haven't looked into getting XP, mainly because my husband doesn't want it. He says it lets Microsoft monitor your machine or something like that. From what I've seen doing the task bar and menu, I think that part is a lot of hipe. I seem to be able to do more with the other version of the task bar and menu (I like to dress things up differently and the XP seems to have a mind of its own - all look alike.) Frankly, personally, if I wanted plain Jane I would just stick with Windows. But, I did want to do at least one just to see if I could, but honestly prefer the other Windows version.

Thanks for your tip again. Guess I'm going to have to read through some of the codes to see what the differences are and what they do. Would rather be creating, but I guess it goes with the territory when you are learning.

Hope you have a great Thanksgiving too!
feline
Reply #8 Friday, November 23, 2001 9:49 AM
starone - Read your one of those days threads. Sounds tough. At least there is always light at the end of the tunnel

feline goes skipping up the tunnel to cuddle the oncoming train

starone - You have been really great taking the time to help. I really do appreciate it.

generally people around here are very helpful, its one of the reasons this is a nice place to be

starone - I also know what you mean about not being to crazy about the XP Start menu. I haven't looked into getting XP, mainly because my husband doesn't want it.

try the new look start menu at 800*600

the general consensus is that XP doesnt really offer much over win2k for most users. depending on which windows you are currently running you may not be missing much

starone - Thanks for your tip again. Guess I'm going to have to read through some of the codes to see what the differences are and what they do. Would rather be creating, but I guess it goes with the territory when you are learning.

i would suggest just scanning down the list of settings for anything that sounds relivent.

when you have some candidates, try changing them one at a time. you should be able to figure out which ones are the ones you want quite quickly that way.

dont be afraid to experiment, after all, what can possibly go wrong? *manic g*
starone
Reply #9 Friday, November 23, 2001 11:35 AM
Thanks for your reply. Finally got things together and the graphics re-worked. Turned out better than I expected but, after finishing it, the bar doesn't look much like an XP (or what I have seen of the XP's). Oh well, at least you can't say it's cloned and it is a functioning bar. Besides, how do you do an XP without it looking like all other XP's? Have to ponder that one.
feline
Reply #10 Friday, November 23, 2001 12:19 PM
i am going to go out on a limb here, and suggest that perhaps you dont do an XP look?

have you checked out the objectbar section here? most of the bars in there seem to be XP like.

remember, variety is the spice of life
starone
Reply #11 Friday, November 23, 2001 7:59 PM
Thanks. After I do the icons, I might muster up the courage to upload it (but don't think I'll name it as an XP just in case - might get laughed out of the community.) Sure scary when you do something new. Had my eyes closed and fingers crossed when I uploaded my first bar.

feline
Reply #12 Monday, November 26, 2001 9:24 AM
i dont know. if it doesnt look all that much like XP then this might be a good thing, since that look has been a little over exposed

as for what other people think, does it really matter? if you like it, and are happy with it then that should be enough. also, dont pay to much attention to detractors who havent put together their own OB skin, since they probably dont appreaciate what went into it.
starone
Reply #13 Monday, November 26, 2001 9:51 AM
Thanks, I'll keep that in mind. I guess there's no harm in trying. Just found out from Journeyman that I won't be able to use the XP part in my windowblinds since I can't test it out (as you know I don't have XP). He said ME doesn't skin all the parts that XP includes so I can't see the results with ME. I included what I used for the Object Bar and was wondering why I had extra pieces. Well, that was why.

I incorporated the Smart Bars into the blind. When I bring it up in Skin Studio it comes up with author Benefied and doesn't recognize the author when I do code analyze. I was wondering if that was part of the new Windowblinds 3 and I don't need to get permission to use it, or if I do need to get permission to use it. Also, do I need to leave the author part it or can I delete it? Do you have any insight on this?
feline
Reply #14 Monday, November 26, 2001 11:39 AM
feline grapples with the dark side
feline gives in
if you wander over to:
http://www.vim.org/download.html
you can then download gvim 6, which is the windows version of vim 6.

now that we have a proper text editor (note, dont actually do this first bit if you are easily scared , it has more key combinations and features than i know what to do with, and i have been using it for years now. perhaps notepad would be a safer place to start) it is onto the uis file.

to be fair, some of this is alien to me, so i am making this up as i go along
feline makes a mental note to learn skinning one of these days

you can simply set the author of your WB skin directly by editing the relivent items in the [TitlebarSkin] section. the obvious items are:

SkinName=i love chocolate
SkinAuthor=feline
AuthorEmail=
AuthorsURL=

if skinstudio cannot analize the author section, and is giving a stardock name, then i would guess that there is no author info in your UIS file, and that the program is simply using a default value.

as for the smartbars, i am aware that there were some problems with them in the appartment skin in some of the beta builds of WB3. becuase of that i would be a little careful in using them, since i am not quite sure where the problem lay.
starone
Reply #15 Monday, November 26, 2001 3:12 PM
Thanks for your reply. Guess I need to clarify a bit. There isn't a problem with the author bit of the blind itself. Just after I incorporated the smart bar info, I went into the WindowBlinds configuration under Smart Buttons, selected two areas (the menu and the url - which I guess was authored by Neil Banfield). Neil Banfield shows up in Skin Studio as being the author of the menu and the url. Is Banfield part of Stardock and if so do I leave his name in my skin for recognition of this particular area? Also, do I need his permission to use it in my skin? I don't want to do anything wrong in this area. Thought you might have some light on the matter. I suspect since it also shows up under the menu and the url in the WindowBlinds config of Smart Buttons that it is Stardock related.
feline
Reply #16 Tuesday, November 27, 2001 11:41 AM
feline leans back
feline leans back some more
feline falls over backwards
you have just gone SO far over my head it feels like i am at work
feline looks around
DOH, i am at work

are you sure you dont want to go back to talking about OB? i downloaded OB 0.75 this morning and have spent some time producing a truely wonderful dual taskbar effect

feline sets out to embrace own ignorrance
feline needs a longer tail

starone - Neil Banfield shows up in Skin Studio as being the author of the menu and the url. Is Banfield part of Stardock and if so do I leave his name in my skin for recognition of this particular area?

Neil is definetly a stardock person

starone - Just after I incorporated the smart bar info, I went into the WindowBlinds configuration under Smart Buttons, selected two areas (the menu and the url - which I guess was authored by Neil Banfield).

this is quite confusing, since i havent played with smartbars at all at the moment. in fact i dont even have WB3 on this machine at the moment, due to the evil things i keep on doing causing it problems

i was (and still am) under the impression that you simply defined an area of the skin (say on the title bar) as available for smartbars, and then this area was marked as special.

then, when someone uses a skin with smartbars, they specify which buttons they want to place into the smartbar area. thus allowing them to extend the skin without having to know anything about the skin format, or using skinstudio.

taking this as a start point, it sounds like you are specifying specific items to go into the smart bar of your skin via skin studio. is this vaguely on track?

this reference to the url is really confusing me, since i thought that initially there were only a couple of items available for the smartbars, including rollup and always on top buttons. there was talk of a winamp plugin appearing as a smartbar option later. but i dont recall any mention of a url object. also, i am not used to seing anything that i would call a url object in any skin i have yet used.

back to the author question, if skinstudio is listing Neil as the author of the items you are placing into the smartbar, then that would make sence.

are you following any of this still? we (or at least i) may need help soon the way this is going
starone
Reply #17 Tuesday, November 27, 2001 12:09 PM
Thanks, Yes followed it all. I kinda figured he might be Stardock related. Yes, I am specifiying areas of the smartbar to go into the skin. As far as the url, it does show up and that part works fine. You are doing great and don't seem to need any help. (Caused me to laugh - enjoyed the comments.)

Now with that past us, do I need to leave his name in my skin since obviously if he is Stardock related I don't need to get permission. It would be one less analyze message anyway? However, this also brings up another question - do you think I should not specifiy what areas to use, i.e. the menu and the url? I have a problem with the menu anyway - it comes up just fine and everything looks okay when I press my starbar menu button; however only two of the areas work right - showdesktop, view channels. Whenever I select Launch Internet Explorer, Launch Outlook Express, Windows Media Player, MSN Explorer or Winamp it brings these up in Object Edit. Very confusing. Looked at my uis file and can't find anything unusual. I don't know what's going on with it.

You mentioned you created a dual taskbar - bet it looks great.

Sorry about confusing you, but frankly your answers sure make sense. I bet I don't have to specify the particular areas in the blind (probably why it has a problem in the analyze skin part.) Once again, thanks for your comments. They have been very helpful.

starone
Reply #18 Tuesday, November 27, 2001 6:51 PM
I'm so excited. Just got around to downloading the updates for Skin Studio, Object Bar & Windowblinds. Pulled up my skin in Skin Studio and lo and behold if it didn't bring up the taskbar too! I love it. Think it will make life a lot easier. Haven't really got around to see what's new in Object Bar itself, but I love the update in Skin Studio. Noticed they added the Koala player skinning too. Don't have it, but may download it just so I can try to skin it. It's got to be a lot easier than trying to skin Winamp (so many graphic pieces in that one). Well anyway, have a new toy to play with.

I figured if I waited long enough maybe things would start falling into place. With your help it is coming about. Maybe I can wrap up the bar and blinds by the end of next week. This one is a bit different from the ones I have done. I guess you could call it my guinea pig in that I'm trying to add stuff to it that I've never done before. Mainly wanted to learn more.
feline
Reply #19 Wednesday, November 28, 2001 7:46 AM
starone - You are doing great and don't seem to need any help. (Caused me to laugh - enjoyed the comments.)

feline grapples with delusions of compitence

it has just occured to me to have a look at your posted skins. you have 10 skins, including one of the few non XP and non aqua looking OB skins, and here i (with zero skin postings) am wandering around advising you on how to fix these things *shrug*

glad you like the comments

starone - You mentioned you created a dual taskbar - bet it looks great.

it is actually an idea that has been kicked aroung the OB newsgroup a bit of late, from an early beta screenshot i remembered of OB in action.

the idea is to tame the mad number of programs i end up with in my taskbar.

simply create a second taskbar section next to your main taskbar section, and set it to show icons only, and to be non-resizable. this way it will shrink down to only use as much space as required.

at this point, all the items are duplicated. so, now set a load of custom filtering rules for the two taskbars, so that programs only show up on one taskbar or the other. throw in some grouping rules, and suddenly i actually have a managable taskbar for the first time in a very long while.

the only thing with the dual taskbar is that my (rather numerous) grouping rules are machine specific, so not a lot of point in posting the fruits of my labor as a skin update

now if only can be fixed. i have to run so many windows sometimes that scrolls vertically! that scares people, which is rather fun to watch
starone
Reply #20 Wednesday, November 28, 2001 9:02 AM
You sure lost me on the dual taskbar. Don't think it is something I would want to try. I have enough problems just trying to get things to work. For someone who has so much knowledge, maybe you should give skinning a try. Bet you would come up with something really great.

I'm not much on technical stuff. I just put it in and hope it works. If not, have to keep playing with it until it gets figured out. Still trying to iron out the menu thing and have incorporated Winamp into the skin, but am still having some problems in that area. However, I finally managed to get it to work (Winamp that is), but then not being satisfied I moved the buttons around and now it doesn't come up at all. So, guess I have to reset the buttons and try again. It sure would be a lot easier if I knew what I was doing. That's what you call learning the hard way. And, every now and then I have a generous soul giving help.

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