Windows XP (OEM) to be phased out by year
Thursday, April 12, 2007 by BX | Discussion: WinCustomize News
According to a report by famous tech news website Winbeta, Microsoft has decided to phase-out the OEM editions of Windows XP by the end of this year despite consumers resistance to adopt Vista due to compatibility issues and hardware requirements. As a result computer manufacturers will only be able to sale Vista loaded Pc's.
By early 2008, Microsoft's contracts with computer makers will require companies to only sell Vista-loaded machines.
Despite Microsoft's relentless promotion of Vista, manufacturers are still seeing plenty of demand from customers for systems preloaded with XP, especially in the finicky SOHO market.
For complete story, check the link provided
By early 2008, Microsoft's contracts with computer makers will require companies to only sell Vista-loaded machines.
Despite Microsoft's relentless promotion of Vista, manufacturers are still seeing plenty of demand from customers for systems preloaded with XP, especially in the finicky SOHO market.
For complete story, check the link provided
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ZubaZ
Reply #22 Thursday, April 12, 2007 2:02 PM
Reply #22 Thursday, April 12, 2007 2:02 PM
Phoon, I work for a rather large outsourcing company. and we are actively moving to Vista long with our clients and partners (including Dell).
We have seen very few XP applications that fail to run on Vista with existing hardware. And for most users, Vista runs close enough to XP that very little training is needed. (Granted, our COE image puts the most common tools and apps on the desktop to avoid many possible problems.) (As an aside, we are more leery of the new office suite in regards to training . . it's going to be a mess!)
In regards to hardware, almost everything we have and support has enough oomph to run Vista as well as XP. And with a typical 3 year lease/upgrade cycle on PCs the hardware . . any issues can be resolved by waiting until next cycle or speeding up the process.
We heard the same arguments when XP, 2000, and even NT came around. MS stopped OEMing those too and the world didn't end.
For the average home user (and desktop customizer who frequents this site) making Vista the default Microsoft OS will have little or positive impact.
We have seen very few XP applications that fail to run on Vista with existing hardware. And for most users, Vista runs close enough to XP that very little training is needed. (Granted, our COE image puts the most common tools and apps on the desktop to avoid many possible problems.) (As an aside, we are more leery of the new office suite in regards to training . . it's going to be a mess!)
In regards to hardware, almost everything we have and support has enough oomph to run Vista as well as XP. And with a typical 3 year lease/upgrade cycle on PCs the hardware . . any issues can be resolved by waiting until next cycle or speeding up the process.
We heard the same arguments when XP, 2000, and even NT came around. MS stopped OEMing those too and the world didn't end.
For the average home user (and desktop customizer who frequents this site) making Vista the default Microsoft OS will have little or positive impact.
Daiwa
Reply #23 Thursday, April 12, 2007 2:02 PM
Reply #23 Thursday, April 12, 2007 2:02 PM
I've purchased a copy of XPP and put it on the shelf just in case. I have mixed feelings about Vista - the OEM versions that are shipping with most affordable PC's are less capable graphically than XP, which strikes me as an odd "upgrade" strategy on Microsoft's part. Having to pay a premium price for an OS to get what XP will do already?
A Mac with Parallels is looking better all the time.
A Mac with Parallels is looking better all the time.
Phoon
Reply #24 Thursday, April 12, 2007 2:59 PM
Reply #24 Thursday, April 12, 2007 2:59 PM
Zubaz,
That is encouraging news and perhaps it is not as daunting a task as I am fearing. I am running it on my system at work as a test and I have found quite a few of our CORE, CRITICAL applications that will not run under it. The vendor has plans to have it Vista ready by the end of the year.
Many of our web based apps will not run on IE7 either, so we are forced to stick with IE6.
I do agree that Office 2007 is a larger training nightmare than Vista will be, but Vista will still flood the help desk, I'm relatively certain of that.
Hardware... no way, no how on about 60% of our current systems. In this facility alone, that number represents about 300 systems, and we are more up to date than most of the sister facilities.
Curious, what outsourcing company are you with?
That is encouraging news and perhaps it is not as daunting a task as I am fearing. I am running it on my system at work as a test and I have found quite a few of our CORE, CRITICAL applications that will not run under it. The vendor has plans to have it Vista ready by the end of the year.
Many of our web based apps will not run on IE7 either, so we are forced to stick with IE6.
I do agree that Office 2007 is a larger training nightmare than Vista will be, but Vista will still flood the help desk, I'm relatively certain of that.
Hardware... no way, no how on about 60% of our current systems. In this facility alone, that number represents about 300 systems, and we are more up to date than most of the sister facilities.
Curious, what outsourcing company are you with?
Lantec
Reply #25 Thursday, April 12, 2007 3:18 PM
I thought you got swallowed up by corporate Stardock.........
Question, Do you find Vista faster, slower or about the same in day to day work flow. I'm not interested in games or movie playing, just the mundane stuff, sending email writing letters running your regular business apps etc.
Reply #25 Thursday, April 12, 2007 3:18 PM
Phoon, I work for a rather large outsourcing company. and we are actively moving to Vista long with our clients and partners (including Dell).
I thought you got swallowed up by corporate Stardock.........
Question, Do you find Vista faster, slower or about the same in day to day work flow. I'm not interested in games or movie playing, just the mundane stuff, sending email writing letters running your regular business apps etc.
ZubaZ
Reply #27 Thursday, April 12, 2007 3:38 PM
We also have problems with IE7. But we have problems with Firefox to. Bad coding on our part really. We have a few apps that are tieing users to MS's JAVA virtual machine too. Lessons learned, ya know. Running your apps in compatability mode doesn't help you with yoru core apps?
Because of the memory and video card I had, the GUI was scaled back to non-aero but as soon as I got upgraded it scaled up.
Reply #27 Thursday, April 12, 2007 3:38 PM
Curious, what outsourcing company are you with?
Getronics Who are you with?We also have problems with IE7. But we have problems with Firefox to. Bad coding on our part really. We have a few apps that are tieing users to MS's JAVA virtual machine too. Lessons learned, ya know. Running your apps in compatability mode doesn't help you with yoru core apps?
Question, Do you find Vista faster, slower or about the same in day to day work flow. I'm not interested in games or movie playing, just the mundane stuff, sending email writing letters running your regular business apps etc.
I did a clean install and found that for day to day use it ran as well as my 2 year old XP. But any clean install works better than 2 years worth of crap.Because of the memory and video card I had, the GUI was scaled back to non-aero but as soon as I got upgraded it scaled up.
I thought you got swallowed up by corporate Stardock...
Not all the time (yet). 
ZubaZ
Reply #28 Thursday, April 12, 2007 3:40 PM
There is no need to be upset. Use whatever OS does what you need to do at the price-point you are willing to pay. Apple doesn't run the apps *I* run and is more than I want to pay to dual boot.
(and if you are going to buy a new OS [and new hardware] . . why NOT go with Vista?)
Reply #28 Thursday, April 12, 2007 3:40 PM
im considering switching to apple.
There is no need to be upset. Use whatever OS does what you need to do at the price-point you are willing to pay. Apple doesn't run the apps *I* run and is more than I want to pay to dual boot.
(and if you are going to buy a new OS [and new hardware] . . why NOT go with Vista?)
Astyanax
Reply #29 Thursday, April 12, 2007 3:51 PM
Right, and whats to say smaller companies dont? You think there are more large corporations or more small businesses?
Cant say I have ever heard of Joe's PC Barn, they any good? I prefer newegg, a little more reputable I think.
Reply #29 Thursday, April 12, 2007 3:51 PM
Yes, large companies are knocking down the doors of their local "Joe's PC Barn" to have a custom built rig for their thousands of employees to use....
Right, and whats to say smaller companies dont? You think there are more large corporations or more small businesses?
Cant say I have ever heard of Joe's PC Barn, they any good? I prefer newegg, a little more reputable I think.
Phoon
Reply #30 Thursday, April 12, 2007 4:14 PM
Reply #30 Thursday, April 12, 2007 4:14 PM
Tell me Astyanax,
Why would a small or large company have someone build a custom box for them when you can get a business class Dell Optiplex 3.4Ghz Duo Core, 1GB RAM, 80GB Hard drive, DVD/CD-RW, etc for less than $700. This price includes a 17" UltraSharp FP Monitor AND a 3 Year, Next Business day, ON-SITE warranty. Small computer shops and newegg cant compare with that. Having the NBDOS warranty is a great value. It doesn't make sense for a business to go custom box anymore.
Why would a small or large company have someone build a custom box for them when you can get a business class Dell Optiplex 3.4Ghz Duo Core, 1GB RAM, 80GB Hard drive, DVD/CD-RW, etc for less than $700. This price includes a 17" UltraSharp FP Monitor AND a 3 Year, Next Business day, ON-SITE warranty. Small computer shops and newegg cant compare with that. Having the NBDOS warranty is a great value. It doesn't make sense for a business to go custom box anymore.
vStyler
Reply #32 Thursday, April 12, 2007 4:19 PM
No way in hell.
Reply #32 Thursday, April 12, 2007 4:19 PM
all i know is that vista runs 5-10 times faster on my machine than XP did and thats with not changing any hardware. I have upgraded my memory since but thats it.
No way in hell.
Astyanax
Reply #33 Thursday, April 12, 2007 4:33 PM
Most small businesses generally like to pay as little as possible. And to many of them buying 20+ 700$ machines is unacceptable, trust me I've been there.
Reply #33 Thursday, April 12, 2007 4:33 PM
Why would a small or large company have someone build a custom box for them when you can get a business class Dell Optiplex 3.4Ghz Duo Core, 1GB RAM, 80GB Hard drive, DVD/CD-RW, etc for less than $700.
Most small businesses generally like to pay as little as possible. And to many of them buying 20+ 700$ machines is unacceptable, trust me I've been there.
joda
Reply #34 Thursday, April 12, 2007 5:05 PM
Reply #34 Thursday, April 12, 2007 5:05 PM
Just out of curiosity, if the OS you have now runs the applications you need then why would you ever want to change? I mean its a tool not a toy. I've been doing this since '85 and and to me my computer is like any other tool.
ZubaZ
Reply #35 Thursday, April 12, 2007 5:09 PM
Reply #35 Thursday, April 12, 2007 5:09 PM
Oh, Zubaz..
I'm with Perot Systems....
And thus the bitterness is explained. I'm with Perot Systems....
Phoon
Reply #36 Thursday, April 12, 2007 5:24 PM
Are you trying to tell me that you are going to get a "Home built" system that will run Vista, nicely, with all the specs that I provided (Including ON-Site Warranty and OS)for under $700. No way, now how.. If so, it's going to be using junk parts and will cost more in the long run.
Reply #36 Thursday, April 12, 2007 5:24 PM
Most small businesses generally like to pay as little as possible. And to many of them buying 20+ 700$ machines is unacceptable, trust me I've been there.
Are you trying to tell me that you are going to get a "Home built" system that will run Vista, nicely, with all the specs that I provided (Including ON-Site Warranty and OS)for under $700. No way, now how.. If so, it's going to be using junk parts and will cost more in the long run.
ZubaZ
Reply #37 Thursday, April 12, 2007 5:32 PM
Reply #37 Thursday, April 12, 2007 5:32 PM
We have a similar deal with Dell. And the real value they bring is the service. PC breaks, call Dell, new part same day.
No other shop can beat the mass production price plus service.
No other shop can beat the mass production price plus service.
Astyanax
Reply #38 Thursday, April 12, 2007 6:34 PM
You bet your ass I am, www.newegg.com can be your best friend when shopping for computer parts.
Not every business wants to spend craploads of money to go thru contracts with dell, most of these companies I deal with have a problem forking over 1500 for an extremely low end server.
You seem to think that every small business is made of money. And im sure your next arguement will be Vista's price, well it aint that expensive for home premium.
I just think its complete bullcrap that some of you think upgrading to Vista is not only a hassle but it actually performs worse than XP. With the current memory management Vista has thats impossible. Perhaps you need to sit down and actually try Vista rather than going to a store like CompUSA and clicking around for 2 minutes, on a low end, left over XP based machine.
And with that I will no longer be part of this discussion as its going no where pretty fast.
Reply #38 Thursday, April 12, 2007 6:34 PM
Are you trying to tell me that you are going to get a "Home built" system that will run Vista, nicely, with all the specs that I provided (Including ON-Site Warranty and OS)for under $700. No way, now how.. If so, it's going to be using junk parts and will cost more in the long run.
You bet your ass I am, www.newegg.com can be your best friend when shopping for computer parts.
Not every business wants to spend craploads of money to go thru contracts with dell, most of these companies I deal with have a problem forking over 1500 for an extremely low end server.
You seem to think that every small business is made of money. And im sure your next arguement will be Vista's price, well it aint that expensive for home premium.
I just think its complete bullcrap that some of you think upgrading to Vista is not only a hassle but it actually performs worse than XP. With the current memory management Vista has thats impossible. Perhaps you need to sit down and actually try Vista rather than going to a store like CompUSA and clicking around for 2 minutes, on a low end, left over XP based machine.
And with that I will no longer be part of this discussion as its going no where pretty fast.
Phoon
Reply #39 Thursday, April 12, 2007 8:54 PM
Reply #39 Thursday, April 12, 2007 8:54 PM
It's a sad shame that you fail to actually READ and UNDERSTAND what people are trying to tell you. No, you won't get that pricing without a service agreement, but it won't break the bank by getting it through the normal channels either.
In either case, it's the company's decision to make (based on your input). Good luck to you.
I've been doing this work longer than you've been alive and I've yet to make a business decision or product evaluation from a 2 minute trip to "CompUSA". I also do independent service contracts and consulting with small businesses (one of which happens to be a mortgage funding office). I would NEVER steer them into a "Home Built" system either unless it was for one or 2 systems ONLY. I've been down that road before and it doesn't work in the long run and will cost the company more in the long run. Don't be so short sighted, you'll get farther in your career.
In either case, it's the company's decision to make (based on your input). Good luck to you.
I've been doing this work longer than you've been alive and I've yet to make a business decision or product evaluation from a 2 minute trip to "CompUSA". I also do independent service contracts and consulting with small businesses (one of which happens to be a mortgage funding office). I would NEVER steer them into a "Home Built" system either unless it was for one or 2 systems ONLY. I've been down that road before and it doesn't work in the long run and will cost the company more in the long run. Don't be so short sighted, you'll get farther in your career.
Ghostrider359
Reply #40 Friday, April 13, 2007 12:00 PM
If XP didn't run very well on this machine (or its previous hardware setup)...it probably wasn't XP's fault entirely. Doing a new install of Vista on a machine with years of crap loaded into XP...yes, Vista will probably outperform it right out of the box. However, all the benchmark/testing sites showed Vista was slower than XP clean install vs. clean install. With all the crap loaded into Vista and all the heavy handed memory hogging graphic eye candy thats about 6 years too late...yeah I'll stick with XP...or go back to Macs.
Right now I'm running Ubuntu Linux 7.04 "Feisty Fawn" Beta on my laptop with a dual boot to XP and with all the 3D graphics/transparency and window effects type eye candy you get with the Beryl manager software for Linux...it still runs pretty well on 512MB RAM. Supposedly you can't even consider running the Aero interface with less than 1GB.
When I login to ubuntuforums.org I see so many people switching to Linux, that were previously terrified by it but have now seen the interface come around to a point where its now more user-friendly. However, you still have to do some manual work in the command line, but the plug and play and hardware detection is superb. For example, there aren't any Linux drivers for the cable modem I'm using, but just plug it in and it still works anyway. You can't always say that with XP and apparently you really can't say that for Vista just yet.
Reply #40 Friday, April 13, 2007 12:00 PM
AMD Athlon 64 X2 4400+ Toledo 2.2GHz
OCZ Platinum Series DDR400 2GB (2x1GB) 2-3-2-5 T1
Abit KN8 v1.1 nForce 4 Motherboard
ATi connect3D Radeon X1950XTX 512MB
Thermaltake Truepower Trio 550w
OCZ Platinum Series DDR400 2GB (2x1GB) 2-3-2-5 T1
Abit KN8 v1.1 nForce 4 Motherboard
ATi connect3D Radeon X1950XTX 512MB
Thermaltake Truepower Trio 550w
If XP didn't run very well on this machine (or its previous hardware setup)...it probably wasn't XP's fault entirely. Doing a new install of Vista on a machine with years of crap loaded into XP...yes, Vista will probably outperform it right out of the box. However, all the benchmark/testing sites showed Vista was slower than XP clean install vs. clean install. With all the crap loaded into Vista and all the heavy handed memory hogging graphic eye candy thats about 6 years too late...yeah I'll stick with XP...or go back to Macs.
Right now I'm running Ubuntu Linux 7.04 "Feisty Fawn" Beta on my laptop with a dual boot to XP and with all the 3D graphics/transparency and window effects type eye candy you get with the Beryl manager software for Linux...it still runs pretty well on 512MB RAM. Supposedly you can't even consider running the Aero interface with less than 1GB.
When I login to ubuntuforums.org I see so many people switching to Linux, that were previously terrified by it but have now seen the interface come around to a point where its now more user-friendly. However, you still have to do some manual work in the command line, but the plug and play and hardware detection is superb. For example, there aren't any Linux drivers for the cable modem I'm using, but just plug it in and it still works anyway. You can't always say that with XP and apparently you really can't say that for Vista just yet.
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Reply #21 Thursday, April 12, 2007 1:59 PM
Ummmm.........