Is the Constitution a non-smokers Document?
Wednesday, January 26, 2005 by wmsco | Discussion: Blogging
We have passed Legislation limiting the Rights of smokers, where they can Eat, what restaurants, what jobs, put out in the cold, what appartments etc., the list goes on and on!
Did we do this to the different nationalities? Did we legalise a certain life style?
If we squeeze out the last smoker, who is next?
Did we do this to the different nationalities? Did we legalise a certain life style?
If we squeeze out the last smoker, who is next?
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RPGFX
Reply #82 Thursday, January 27, 2005 10:32 AM
This is utter bull crap. Nobody is trying to dictate our lifestyle. Banning public smoking is not trying to get everyone to eventually be exactly the same... it's a law to protect innocent people...children from harmful toxic second hand smoke. Don't you get it? It's really not that hard to understand. Nobody is telling you that you can't smoke... your simply not going to be allowed to harm other people with it.
Reply #82 Thursday, January 27, 2005 10:32 AM
| you have become blind to what has been said you are allowing laws and restrictions to be applied that are paving the way, the doors swung wide open, quote {there working on it} unquote,and they will come against your life style untill eventually there is only one exceptable lifestyle and being ignorant you allow it to happen because of legistration already done. You have failed to grasp that! |
This is utter bull crap. Nobody is trying to dictate our lifestyle. Banning public smoking is not trying to get everyone to eventually be exactly the same... it's a law to protect innocent people...children from harmful toxic second hand smoke. Don't you get it? It's really not that hard to understand. Nobody is telling you that you can't smoke... your simply not going to be allowed to harm other people with it.
KarmaGirl
Reply #83 Thursday, January 27, 2005 10:59 AM
Reply #83 Thursday, January 27, 2005 10:59 AM
| Stop being so selfish and thinking only about things that affect you and the lifestyle in your lifetimes! Why not instead concentrate on things that will have a better impact on your younger generations and those to come. |
It always bothers me when I go to a public place that still allows smoking with my daughter. Most restaurants that still have smoking sections smell like smoke in the entire establishment. My daughter shouldn't have to be subjected to that.
Ever see those commercials trying to get parents to quit smoking? The ones that have a kid saying "I smoke a cigarette before I eat breakfast" or "I smoke while I take a nap".
This society is filled with too many people who believe that "laws" should protect them, and not society as a whole.
Ever actually read the constitution? As a refresher, this is how it starts:
"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America. "
General Welfare- not individual liberties. If something is proved to be dangerous to general welfare, how can it be unconstitutional to limit where and when it can be used?
XX
Reply #84 Thursday, January 27, 2005 11:11 AM
Indeed. We had a chance to vote for banning smoking so we don't have to breathe in your smoke. I can't smell, so it's worse for me. I could unknowing breathe in smoke crap from someone at back of me or something. I would only know AFTER I see smoke. Majority of smokers, including my own mom, always put out butts on roads, grass, etc. My own mom does leave a lot of butts on curb near my home.
So what about when I don't WANT to? For example, when I'm eating my breakfast in some restaurant? I can't just leave then.
Like I said before, Your right to throw a punch ends at edge of my nose. It's same for smoking. Your right to smoke anywhere ends at edge of sharing air with me. Why? The smoke is damned toxic. You say air is polluted anyway? Not in place I live.
Reply #84 Thursday, January 27, 2005 11:11 AM
| You don't half to breath my smoke you have a choice, leave but god for bid that! |
Indeed. We had a chance to vote for banning smoking so we don't have to breathe in your smoke. I can't smell, so it's worse for me. I could unknowing breathe in smoke crap from someone at back of me or something. I would only know AFTER I see smoke. Majority of smokers, including my own mom, always put out butts on roads, grass, etc. My own mom does leave a lot of butts on curb near my home.
| by the way I am a Smoker and I say if my smoke offends you - leave. |
So what about when I don't WANT to? For example, when I'm eating my breakfast in some restaurant? I can't just leave then.
Like I said before, Your right to throw a punch ends at edge of my nose. It's same for smoking. Your right to smoke anywhere ends at edge of sharing air with me. Why? The smoke is damned toxic. You say air is polluted anyway? Not in place I live.
RedBuzzard
Reply #85 Thursday, January 27, 2005 11:32 AM
What Planet are you guys living on?
Reply #85 Thursday, January 27, 2005 11:32 AM
| clean air |
| air that is free from toxic carcinogens |
What Planet are you guys living on?
kona0197
Reply #86 Thursday, January 27, 2005 4:59 PM
Well I keep costs down by rolling my own cigarettes. So I spend about 20 a month and that's it. But like other people I'm wondering where people get this idea that the air is clean. If you think it is your a fool.
Reply #86 Thursday, January 27, 2005 4:59 PM
| Kona, comparing prohibition to a company being forced into bankruptcy are 2 different things. Eventually the cost of fighting lawsuits will overtake the profit and that's when American cig manufacturers will stop making them. Of course imported cigs will always be available but the taxes on them will be so high only the rich will be able to afford it. You think $5 a pack is high, just wait. |
Well I keep costs down by rolling my own cigarettes. So I spend about 20 a month and that's it. But like other people I'm wondering where people get this idea that the air is clean. If you think it is your a fool.
XX
Reply #87 Thursday, January 27, 2005 5:04 PM
The Planet Earth, or in least sectors not too polluted.
Reply #87 Thursday, January 27, 2005 5:04 PM
| What Planet are you guys living on? |
The Planet Earth, or in least sectors not too polluted.
aufisch
Reply #88 Thursday, January 27, 2005 5:41 PM
Reply #88 Thursday, January 27, 2005 5:41 PM
Not everyone lives in a smog-polluted city. Toxic pollution of the air (not CO2 levels) has actually decreased since the early 20th century, due to filter treatments in industrial plants, catalysators in cars.....
I can't find the link at the moment, but there was a study somewhere in Europe that looked at lung-diseases in waiters and waitresses (in most European countries smoking is still permitted in restaurants and bars). The results were shocking, even waiters/waitresses that didn't smoke themselves experienced a 10 fold increase in lung diseases.
Another study (they were both done about 10 years ago) found out that the smoke inhaled from 'secondary' smoking, was actually more toxic than what smokers inhale themselves.
On a private side: My father was a very heavy smoker since he was about 18. He mostly smoked at home and I therefore spend a lot of my childhood in a smoked filled room. If now (as an adult) I get a cough I always get it much worse than everyone else, my doctor says that this is due to a "weak' bronchial system caused most likely by 'secondary smoking' as a child...
...my father stopped smoking three years ago when he almost lost a leg due to clogging of the veins caused by excessive smoking...
No one forbids you to smoke out in the open air. The argument that the air is already polluted (although true for some places) does therefore not apply here. The trouble is with enclosed and semi-enclosed (eg. entrances to libraries and other public places) rooms. In those places toxins and smoke particles accumulate to a level that it is simply not safe anymore to inhale. Now, 30 years ago we did not know that, but then 30 years ago it was not compulsory to wear a seatbelt in a car either. Fact is that we now know more and we have the obligation to react to this knowledge.
I can't find the link at the moment, but there was a study somewhere in Europe that looked at lung-diseases in waiters and waitresses (in most European countries smoking is still permitted in restaurants and bars). The results were shocking, even waiters/waitresses that didn't smoke themselves experienced a 10 fold increase in lung diseases.
Another study (they were both done about 10 years ago) found out that the smoke inhaled from 'secondary' smoking, was actually more toxic than what smokers inhale themselves.
On a private side: My father was a very heavy smoker since he was about 18. He mostly smoked at home and I therefore spend a lot of my childhood in a smoked filled room. If now (as an adult) I get a cough I always get it much worse than everyone else, my doctor says that this is due to a "weak' bronchial system caused most likely by 'secondary smoking' as a child...
...my father stopped smoking three years ago when he almost lost a leg due to clogging of the veins caused by excessive smoking...
No one forbids you to smoke out in the open air. The argument that the air is already polluted (although true for some places) does therefore not apply here. The trouble is with enclosed and semi-enclosed (eg. entrances to libraries and other public places) rooms. In those places toxins and smoke particles accumulate to a level that it is simply not safe anymore to inhale. Now, 30 years ago we did not know that, but then 30 years ago it was not compulsory to wear a seatbelt in a car either. Fact is that we now know more and we have the obligation to react to this knowledge.
kingbee
Reply #89 Friday, January 28, 2005 6:54 AM
Reply #89 Friday, January 28, 2005 6:54 AM
what about my 'right' to possess plutonium and shoot heroin? btw tobacco was criminalized by james 1; opium was known to be addictive by the ancient greeks (and probably earlier than that) yet no law criminalized its possesion until the harrison act (admittedly, that was a taxation issue but one that was driven, in part, by unionist samuel gompers' prejudice against chinese immigrant laborers).
carolelee
Reply #90 Friday, January 28, 2005 8:44 AM
Reply #90 Friday, January 28, 2005 8:44 AM
Gee, I live in a rural area and from time to time I smell smog from the city.......so I guess it drifts, huh. Time to wake up and smell the smog...opps, I mean coffee
msladydeath
Reply #91 Friday, January 28, 2005 11:35 PM
Actually, you would be arrested for attempted murder, your not legally allowed to kill yourself, and if you fail, you can be arrested for trying.
I personally think that is a load of bulunkie, I can smoke myself to death, drink myself to death, I can eat myself to death, starve myself to death, dehidrate myself to death, etc. However, I cannot drive without a seat belt, ride without a helmet, shot myself and live, etc.
I don't want people forcing me to live, healthy or not, that is my right, I am the age of the majority. Don't want me to smoke in Government offices, fine, don't want me to smoke in your buisness, fine, but don't force buisnesses to ban smoking if they don't want to, it should be up to the owner of the buisness, that should be a right of the buisness owner, their choice, not the non-smoking public. If a bar owner wants a non smoking bar, fine, good for them, if a bar owner wants smoking in his bar, fine, good for him.
I don't understand why non smokers want all public places (other than government buildings) to be non smoking only. Locally, there are non smoking bars, smoking bars, non smoking resturants, and smoking resurants, The point is, there are choices if you want to hang out in the toxins or not.
Reply #91 Friday, January 28, 2005 11:35 PM
| It'd be like if I decided my luck was so good I should play Russian Roulette every day. |
Actually, you would be arrested for attempted murder, your not legally allowed to kill yourself, and if you fail, you can be arrested for trying.
I personally think that is a load of bulunkie, I can smoke myself to death, drink myself to death, I can eat myself to death, starve myself to death, dehidrate myself to death, etc. However, I cannot drive without a seat belt, ride without a helmet, shot myself and live, etc.
I don't want people forcing me to live, healthy or not, that is my right, I am the age of the majority. Don't want me to smoke in Government offices, fine, don't want me to smoke in your buisness, fine, but don't force buisnesses to ban smoking if they don't want to, it should be up to the owner of the buisness, that should be a right of the buisness owner, their choice, not the non-smoking public. If a bar owner wants a non smoking bar, fine, good for them, if a bar owner wants smoking in his bar, fine, good for him.
I don't understand why non smokers want all public places (other than government buildings) to be non smoking only. Locally, there are non smoking bars, smoking bars, non smoking resturants, and smoking resurants, The point is, there are choices if you want to hang out in the toxins or not.
kona0197
Reply #93 Friday, January 28, 2005 11:46 PM
It's probably because the non-smokers are a bit lazy. Why make choices? Get rid of all smoking places!
Reply #93 Friday, January 28, 2005 11:46 PM
| I don't understand why non smokers want all public places (other than government buildings) to be non smoking only. Locally, there are non smoking bars, smoking bars, non smoking resturants, and smoking resurants, The point is, there are choices if you want to hang out in the toxins or not. |
It's probably because the non-smokers are a bit lazy. Why make choices? Get rid of all smoking places!
AtlanticCanadianScot
Reply #94 Saturday, January 29, 2005 12:06 AM
Reply #94 Saturday, January 29, 2005 12:06 AM
Jesus....this is a bumper crop day for issues that are rooted in common sense being cast to the wind....we have the same draconian laws here as well....the non-smoking lobby is getting more rabid with each passing day to say the least...when one cannot walk down a tree lined street next to a park on the way to shop in a neighbourhood, or better yet, IN THE PARK, cannot sit on a bench in the sun pondering the statuary, trees & abundance of exotic horticulture amoungst the duck ponds without BEING ARRESTED in the open air of our God given community, it seems we get closer to George Orwell's 1984 in many regards. Thx for bringing this point of view to the public domain WMSCO
Fond Regards From Atlantic Canada
Fond Regards From Atlantic Canada
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Reply #81 Thursday, January 27, 2005 10:24 AM
By the way, I don't really own any filthy rats... I was just making a point.