Discouraged. Is our community as we know it coming to an end?

Tuesday, December 9, 2003 by Frogboy | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk

A large percentage of you who read this are already WinCustomize premium subscribers. You've already done your part to help this site keep going.

But I must say, things are grim this holiday season here. 2 expensive servers are down. We must get 2 new servers in here. We need to get another 2 servers on top of that for redundancy but that can wait a bit. But it's depressing knowing that millions visit this site each month and we've only gotten 156 new subscribers since the subscription drive began. It definitely makes a strong case that perhaps the days of free skins are over. That the skin authors and web masters, who pull their weight, should move towards a more commercial model that benefits primarily those who contribute (skinners, subscribers, and developers). 

My friend Scott (Jark) has much the same problems over at deviantART: http://news.deviantart.com/article/12039/

That is, the problem of having massive MASSIVE traffic but only a tiny fraction of those users paying the bill. Many people think, incorrectly, that massive traffic == money. It doesn't.

I can tell you, those of you who have purchased premium subscriptions here have helped the community in ways that the average user can't possibly fathom.  Premium subscribers combined with the volunteer efforts of this site's administrators (Jafo, Boxxi, DavidK, Treetog, Alexandrie, Kaosati, MikeB, Hippy, and others) are what keep things going.

Without the premium subscriptions, I can tell you right now what would happen.  This site would slowly morph into being a purely Stardock oriented site with bandwidth caps for all users (including Object Desktop users - though theirs would be higher). Support for non-Stardock sections would slowly disappear or be restricted to subscribers only.  The wallpaper section would only be available to those who either have a wallpaper on there that got accepted or subscribers (in all these exaples, anyone with apprentice access or higher would be treated as a subscriber).

There would be banner ads, and things would become vastly more commercial. Instead of a free Christmas suite, it would be a $8 Christmas suite. Instead of free skins, a new system would b eput in place to allow authors to sell their skins as part of te library once they had achieved a certain access level. One-click purchasing by users with the skin authors getting a percent.

That is the commercialized future of skinning. The alternative. It's not necessarily dark and evil. But it is a much different world than what we have now. I suspect many skin authors out there would jump at the chance of being able to get paid for their skins.

I've posted for years that our community is made up of 3 co-equal groups: The skinners, the web masters, and the users.  We webmasters are doing everythign we can.  The skinners have done their part.  The users have to do their part as a collective.  Which means of the 75,000 unique visitors this site gets each day, 500 more of them need to contribute back too.  As the alternative to voluntarily helping will be paying bits and pieces here and there for skins and themes.  The alternative is a smaller community, a more commercialized community but a sustainable one too.

Personally, I hope some balance can be found. While some people think we represent the commercialization of skinning, in reality, we don't. We simply want...must find a sustainable model that allows our community to grow.  We have all seen the instability Deskmod, Skinz.org, and even Customize.org have faced.  The site has grown beyond what Stardock can pay for via Object Desktop sales.  While Stardock's revenue has grown, the traffic to this site has DOUBLED this year.

Like I said, a large percentage of you have already done your part. There's nothing more you can do.  But hopefully, the millions of people who come to this site will have some infintesible number of them that recognize that someone has to pay for all this stuff. 

The end of the year may end up being the end of this site as we know it. Those new machines will be purchased one way or the other. But if Stardock ends up having to pay for any of those two new machines, it's going to come with strings attached. Ones that will certainly benefit subscribers but the casual users of the world will probably not like.

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Z06Leonhart
Reply #161 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:35 PM
yup nothing for now
paxx
Reply #162 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:35 PM

Kona, I think you should see a doctor about your contradiction affliction.

Sometimes I can't believe you're an adult. I wouldn't even give you 12 years of age.
Anyway, I'm growing tired of you, as a few people here do as well, I'm sure. Why don't you just move all your opinion postings to the ThemeXP website. I'm sure they'd love to hear it. They have forums there too you know.

kona0197
Reply #163 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:35 PM
Maybe we should PAY Kona to use our WB skins...


Well currently I am using windowblinds with the Christmas theme installed.
elvee
Reply #164 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:40 PM
I will be going into my 3rd year of OD subscription in Jan and will reup for WC Subscription in May.

I understand that I have done my part and this is primarily focused on non-subscribers, but I don't want to see WC go down the toilet because people will take a free ride and ride it for all it's worth.

I have started purchasing cool stuff from the WC Store, and even when I have bought everything up, I would even donate a little here and a little there to keep doing my part. I love this place too much to even consider otherwise. No other site even comes close to what the Admins here have provided for us(well there was Skinz.org...but everyone knows that story...). Thats why this is home to me.

The ride will continue, till someone puts on the brakes...IMHO



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I.R. Brainiac
Reply #165 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:41 PM
Sir Hus,Whats the difference between 5$ for a premium suite(of which you may not even use all of)and 1$ for an individual premium skin?There will allways be good free skins,some produced by the same people that make the premium stuff.Sounds cheaper to me to be able to buy ala-cart.

.I would eventually attemt to turn proffessional anyway,if I didnt I would have to stop skinning or produce very little.If Wincustomise were to implement this option,I would benefit from their massive exposure vs. starting my own fledgeling site(which I still plan to do).

.Do you really mean to say that skinners shouldnt be compensated anything for their efforts?I'm currently unemployed after 17 years of being self-employed.I NEED to find a way to make money doing something.Why not something I enjoy?Skinning up intil now has just been for fun and honing my PS skills till I felt I was good enough to turn professional,I think I'm nearing that point.

.So my point is this,if I cant sell skins occasionally and I have to quit...the net result is the same .No more skins produced(or very few).

.On the other hand,if I can generate some revenue from skinning,I can afford to produce some freebies to feed the fire.Still results in the same amount of free stuff,but one way I get something and another I dont.So you can see why I would be behind such a scheme.I can certainly see why others would not.
kona0197
Reply #166 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:42 PM
Kona, I think you should see a doctor about your contradiction affliction.Sometimes I can't believe you're an adult. I wouldn't even give you 12 years of age.Anyway, I'm growing tired of you, as a few people here do as well, I'm sure. Why don't you just move all your opinion postings to the ThemeXP website. I'm sure they'd love to hear it. They have forums there too you know.


And I think you should not use personal attacks on the message board.

If I bother you so be it. Just ignore me.

No one forces you to read my posts. >
paxx
Reply #167 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:45 PM

WOM, premium suites is fine. But opening the possibility to start charging individual skins or objects isn't right IMO. You can expect all good authors to start charging, and all that'll be left is the lesser good ones.

Here is a quote of Frogboy's post:`

1) Any skin author with journeyman or higher, when they upload a skin, icon package, theme, or wallpaper can set a check to have it become premium. It would cost $1.99 to $3.99 to purchase depending on what it was. The skin author would receive 25%.  It would be a 1 click type purchase.

WinCustomize subscribers would get a 50% discount on the prices. It would help skin authors get compensated for their skins, help encourage better skinning, and give new skinners a goal - to climb up the ladder to become a Journeyman.  And it would help WinCustomize.  Users, on the other hand, would likely find that many skins that were "free" were now not free anymore.

He didn't say suites, he said "skin, icon package, theme, or wallpaper"...
I don't agree with that.  Of course, it's just an idea, and may not get implemented, but I'm just voicing my opinion about it.


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I.R. Brainiac
Reply #168 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:47 PM
"Maybe that is why I do not download them here."" I use style XP hence I get my skins at Themexp""...Well currently I am using windowblinds with the Christmas theme installed. ".......Kona you never fail to disappoint.

.




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kona0197
Reply #169 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:50 PM
OK OK OK lets get this sorted. I mostly use Style XP but they did not have any good Christmas themes so I loaded up my Windowblinds and DL'ed the Christmas theme.

But that is beside the point.

WHAT GIVES ANY OF YOU PEOPLE THE RIGHT TO YELL AT ME AND POKE FUN?

Give it a rest.
Sugaree
Reply #170 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:51 PM
here we go again ........
elvee
Reply #171 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:52 PM
Come on Guys, Just cut it out please?

I hate it when people start arguing here >



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paxx
Reply #172 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:54 PM

Who is yelling ehre, Kona.

You are annoying, that's all. Like a fly that keeps buzzing around...

kona0197
Reply #173 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:55 PM
well OK if thats how you think of me so be it I care not.
kongit
Reply #174 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:56 PM
I only wish that there were more premium skins for people to download if they were a wincustomize subsriber. I for one would have made Mormegils Christmas Time skin a premium skin. If a susbricption had more to offer then just supporting the site(and a few other little things) more people would buy. Many people aren't that caring and could give a farts wind to what happens to this site.
I.R. Brainiac
Reply #175 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:56 PM
make it so...
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WOM
Reply #176 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:56 PM
kona, are you bi-polar or have some other mental handicap? There must be something wrong with you. How else can you piss so many people off so quickly. Give your fingers a break and in so doing you'll be giving us all a break.



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kongit
Reply #177 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:57 PM
Kona, that little guy inside your head has become inebriated
Hus
Reply #178 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 9:58 PM
Braniac just proved my point. If he has the option to sell skins, why wouldn't he? Why should he make them for free? That type of thinking is likely to carry over with the rest of the authors...if the option is made so easily available...what do they have to lose? I don't mind spending $5 here, $8 there...but I would HATE having to pay for each skin I download...

But I don't think Froboy meant for us to take it so literally...as I'm quite sure there would be more planning involved covering up loose ends...I'm just trying to get the point across that I would very much dislike the paying-per-download thing...
I.R. Brainiac
Reply #179 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 10:00 PM
Perhaps we shouldnt pick on you Kona...you just make it so darn easy.
kona0197
Reply #180 Wednesday, December 10, 2003 10:00 PM
kona, are you bi-polar or have some other mental handicap?


Actually I suffer from ADD. And I have no health care so no meds.

I will take a break. For everyone's sake.

And for the record, I DO care what happens to this site.

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