Discouraged. Is our community as we know it coming to an end?

Tuesday, December 9, 2003 by Frogboy | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk

A large percentage of you who read this are already WinCustomize premium subscribers. You've already done your part to help this site keep going.

But I must say, things are grim this holiday season here. 2 expensive servers are down. We must get 2 new servers in here. We need to get another 2 servers on top of that for redundancy but that can wait a bit. But it's depressing knowing that millions visit this site each month and we've only gotten 156 new subscribers since the subscription drive began. It definitely makes a strong case that perhaps the days of free skins are over. That the skin authors and web masters, who pull their weight, should move towards a more commercial model that benefits primarily those who contribute (skinners, subscribers, and developers). 

My friend Scott (Jark) has much the same problems over at deviantART: http://news.deviantart.com/article/12039/

That is, the problem of having massive MASSIVE traffic but only a tiny fraction of those users paying the bill. Many people think, incorrectly, that massive traffic == money. It doesn't.

I can tell you, those of you who have purchased premium subscriptions here have helped the community in ways that the average user can't possibly fathom.  Premium subscribers combined with the volunteer efforts of this site's administrators (Jafo, Boxxi, DavidK, Treetog, Alexandrie, Kaosati, MikeB, Hippy, and others) are what keep things going.

Without the premium subscriptions, I can tell you right now what would happen.  This site would slowly morph into being a purely Stardock oriented site with bandwidth caps for all users (including Object Desktop users - though theirs would be higher). Support for non-Stardock sections would slowly disappear or be restricted to subscribers only.  The wallpaper section would only be available to those who either have a wallpaper on there that got accepted or subscribers (in all these exaples, anyone with apprentice access or higher would be treated as a subscriber).

There would be banner ads, and things would become vastly more commercial. Instead of a free Christmas suite, it would be a $8 Christmas suite. Instead of free skins, a new system would b eput in place to allow authors to sell their skins as part of te library once they had achieved a certain access level. One-click purchasing by users with the skin authors getting a percent.

That is the commercialized future of skinning. The alternative. It's not necessarily dark and evil. But it is a much different world than what we have now. I suspect many skin authors out there would jump at the chance of being able to get paid for their skins.

I've posted for years that our community is made up of 3 co-equal groups: The skinners, the web masters, and the users.  We webmasters are doing everythign we can.  The skinners have done their part.  The users have to do their part as a collective.  Which means of the 75,000 unique visitors this site gets each day, 500 more of them need to contribute back too.  As the alternative to voluntarily helping will be paying bits and pieces here and there for skins and themes.  The alternative is a smaller community, a more commercialized community but a sustainable one too.

Personally, I hope some balance can be found. While some people think we represent the commercialization of skinning, in reality, we don't. We simply want...must find a sustainable model that allows our community to grow.  We have all seen the instability Deskmod, Skinz.org, and even Customize.org have faced.  The site has grown beyond what Stardock can pay for via Object Desktop sales.  While Stardock's revenue has grown, the traffic to this site has DOUBLED this year.

Like I said, a large percentage of you have already done your part. There's nothing more you can do.  But hopefully, the millions of people who come to this site will have some infintesible number of them that recognize that someone has to pay for all this stuff. 

The end of the year may end up being the end of this site as we know it. Those new machines will be purchased one way or the other. But if Stardock ends up having to pay for any of those two new machines, it's going to come with strings attached. Ones that will certainly benefit subscribers but the casual users of the world will probably not like.

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bakerstreet
Reply #261 Thursday, December 11, 2003 2:48 PM
*nods*

Hy_Rolr
Reply #262 Thursday, December 11, 2003 3:02 PM
OK, should I go to another forum to ask ? #259 ???
Matchbook
Reply #263 Thursday, December 11, 2003 3:07 PM
KONA: You had mentioned earlier that you do not have a credit card [as I don't myself...]. Do you know someone [family, friends, etc?] with one? I believe many of these people without credit cards *could* purchase a subscription via friend/family member. You can also transfer funds FROM PayPal TO their [the person who paid the 20 dollars for your subscription]online bank account. Is that not an amiable solution? Surely we ALL know someone willing to front 20bux for the time it takes to transfer funds from your PayPal account to their bank account..no?

- just wondering.......
IPlural
Reply #264 Thursday, December 11, 2003 3:09 PM
probably best, ask in the Help section of the message board...

one thing, if you did get an email with your registration information already you can cross reference that info for access to the site. No it is not a subscription exactly but you do have the same access in kind...
Hy_Rolr
Reply #265 Thursday, December 11, 2003 3:14 PM
Thanx
XX
Reply #266 Thursday, December 11, 2003 3:37 PM
That's true.

People needs a sample before they gets hooked.
XX
Reply #267 Thursday, December 11, 2003 3:40 PM
Oops missed 11th page. Ignore my post
IPlural
Reply #268 Thursday, December 11, 2003 3:47 PM
azdruid
Reply #269 Thursday, December 11, 2003 4:02 PM
Xendre64 is going to keep subscribing, because he would get very bored with only having a couple hundred WBA files on his desktop. Long live WC!
HG_Eliminator
Reply #270 Thursday, December 11, 2003 4:26 PM
ordered OD last week and have not received it yet, does this make me a subscriber? is there anything else I can do? I really want to help out the site.


once u create a account here u can combine ur stardock account and ur acount here as well u do it in the account preferences section..but it will only make u a level 3 .. i believe when u combine the two accounts a portion of funds orsumeting comes here for support .. its not the same as if u buy a regular subscription. a full subscription goes directly to WC.. i bought the full stardok line o products and got a subscription here too. i figured the more i added the more i helped out
kona0197
Reply #271 Thursday, December 11, 2003 5:27 PM
KONA: You had mentioned earlier that you do not have a credit card [as I don't myself...]. Do you know someone [family, friends, etc?] with one? I believe many of these people without credit cards *could* purchase a subscription via friend/family member. You can also transfer funds FROM PayPal TO their [the person who paid the 20 dollars for your subscription]online bank account. Is that not an amiable solution? Surely we ALL know someone willing to front 20bux for the time it takes to transfer funds from your PayPal account to their bank account..no?


My family has people with credit cards yes. But it is a matter of getting the 20 bucks first. My family dosen't loan money even if your on your deathbed. >
bakerstreet
Reply #272 Thursday, December 11, 2003 5:49 PM
Frogboy: I am pretty sure it had been mentioned more than once in the past, but the 5 meg limit you mention really does not seem to exist. I just logged out to make sure it hadn't been fixed and downloaded 11 megs of material, with a static IP and not deleting any cookies.

This isn't an 'exploit' of your system, you are just making it all freely available, aren't you?

I think that hole needs to be fixed really badly before you settle on what is working as far as a sustainable model. Most of the people who would download without registering probably never know that there is an implied limit, or that there is a need for them to contribute at all. You make it available, and they download it.

As it stands your model is leaking *without* anyone being abusive and getting extra accounts.
bakerstreet
Reply #273 Thursday, December 11, 2003 5:56 PM
P.S. even if you fix it using cookies, people inadvertently or purposely flush their cookies every so often. it is possible someone could casually visit the site over time and download a great deal without bumping the 5 meg limit between flushes.

I think the best method available would be to offer a few sample skins and make the libraries available only to the site's registered users.



[Message Edited]
Jafo
Reply #274 Thursday, December 11, 2003 5:59 PM
Perhaps a time-limited database access....the casual visitor only has access to the older product...and must register to gain access to the new works...
WOM
Reply #275 Thursday, December 11, 2003 6:03 PM
Hum, not bad Jafo. Could set up the sister site with the older stuff and make this site a subscription only site.



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The DJ
Reply #276 Thursday, December 11, 2003 6:09 PM
Just like some forums where you can't access them until you register, maybe you can't download here until you register. You can see whats here, and if you want to download an account is necessary.
[Message Edited]
MadIce
Reply #277 Thursday, December 11, 2003 6:12 PM
Seems fair to me, The DJ.
Fuzzy Logic
Reply #278 Thursday, December 11, 2003 6:12 PM
A few ideas:-

The casual visitor cannot download
The account holder can download 10Mb
The subscriber has no download limits as now

Have additional subscriber rates: 2 yrs $20, 1 yr $12, 6 months $7

The shareware versions come with more skins for trial purposes

People need to dip hands in pockets. The ROI cannot be faulted.
Matchbook
Reply #279 Thursday, December 11, 2003 6:17 PM
*hands everyone their drink of choice* [alcoholic? nah, not necessarily, Just a Dr Pepper here]




The DJ
Reply #280 Thursday, December 11, 2003 6:20 PM
#278 by Scribe Fuzzy Logic - 12/11/2003 6:12:46 PM A few ideas:-The casual visitor cannot download The account holder can download 10Mb




Just as I posted, I'm for the 'no downloads for visitors'. But about the 10meg limit--I'm for dropping the 50meg limit, but 10 may be too small. For instance some wallpapers and sysmetrix skins among others are over a meg and upwards to 4. Perhaps 20?
[Message Edited]

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