Are people affraid to leave negative comments? And should the bar be raised?
Sunday, March 23, 2003 by Aaron W. | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
I've been browsing the WindowBlinds skins for a while now, and have noticed that a good amount of them are very poorly done. The previews reveal graphical and alignment errors galore, and yet somehow they were still added to the collection. What struck me as odd were the comments on these skins. They were all positive about them as a parent is to her 2 year old child about his/her drawing of a house and a tree (which I can understand; he or she is 2 years old).
I have seen skins which almost appear to be farces. As if to step as close the line as possible before the Wincustomize skin-approving dudes just have to say "there's no way in heck this can be added to the WB skin library..."
So what is it? Are people afraid to tell these authors that they need to practice more, and ask them NOT to post every piece of work they create in the process?
I just find it strange that the skins aren't compared against the same standards as the wallpapers. I've had a few wallpapers rejected before, and I believed them to be far less unattractive than many of the skins which made it through the overly-porous sifter.
So does anyone agree that the bar should be raised for WB skins?
I have seen skins which almost appear to be farces. As if to step as close the line as possible before the Wincustomize skin-approving dudes just have to say "there's no way in heck this can be added to the WB skin library..."
So what is it? Are people afraid to tell these authors that they need to practice more, and ask them NOT to post every piece of work they create in the process?
I just find it strange that the skins aren't compared against the same standards as the wallpapers. I've had a few wallpapers rejected before, and I believed them to be far less unattractive than many of the skins which made it through the overly-porous sifter.
So does anyone agree that the bar should be raised for WB skins?
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Aaron W.
Reply #2 Sunday, March 23, 2003 8:48 AM
Reply #2 Sunday, March 23, 2003 8:48 AM
Well in the comments I've read, they've simply been praise and no critique. There's nothing wrong it, but I think contructive critisism inspires them to improve.
I put hours of work into the wallpapers which were rejected, too. I just don't see how they consider fair, though I'm sure they have their reasons.
I put hours of work into the wallpapers which were rejected, too. I just don't see how they consider fair, though I'm sure they have their reasons.
gef
Reply #3 Sunday, March 23, 2003 8:53 AM
Reply #3 Sunday, March 23, 2003 8:53 AM
Could you supply links to the work you have done so that we can see what you consider to be a good standard. Everyone has a different idea of what is good and what isn't. On the whole, if I like something I download it and leave a positive comment. If I don't like it , I don't download it and I don't leave any comment.
To answer your final question - I like it as it is.
To answer your final question - I like it as it is.
IPlural
Reply #4 Sunday, March 23, 2003 8:57 AM
Reply #4 Sunday, March 23, 2003 8:57 AM
Constructive Criticism is one thing....
Negative comments are a load of crap, anyone can throw trash around...
So, I guess it depends on what you mean exacty by Negative comments. CC or a load of crap?
Negative comments are a load of crap, anyone can throw trash around...
So, I guess it depends on what you mean exacty by Negative comments. CC or a load of crap?
JamMeister33
Reply #5 Sunday, March 23, 2003 8:59 AM
Reply #5 Sunday, March 23, 2003 8:59 AM
Simon C is my I, this is first and foremost a skinner's site so the Wallpaper section does go through stricter 'quality control' shall we say. I have certainly seen people leaving critical remarks on other people's skins, sometimes they are constructive and other times merely nit-picking. I don't feel that people are just gushing about every skin that goes up even if there are flaws in it. If your walls are being rejected just know this; every one of us who make walls have had numerous rejections and sometimes the ones rejected are painful to us because we consider them to be very good.
IPlural
Reply #6 Sunday, March 23, 2003 9:04 AM
Reply #6 Sunday, March 23, 2003 9:04 AM
just read your second comment, sorry about that..
Yes CC is a tool of improvement, but then again, choice of verbiage and context decides if it is actually constructive...
personally I do not presume to hold the eye or talent to take anyones work apart piece by piece, though I might make a suggestion about someone that I feel might add to a particular piece of work. Maybe in 2 years after I've got this down pat, while still knowing fully well each day I will learn something new even from those just starting out, I will feel I can be able to critique others...
If your at that point then by all means do so, after all everyday is a day of learning new things along with dealing with the old....
I can tell you this, comments such as " any 3 year old with a box of crayolas could do better" isn't going to win you much influence, respect or any friends
Yes CC is a tool of improvement, but then again, choice of verbiage and context decides if it is actually constructive...
personally I do not presume to hold the eye or talent to take anyones work apart piece by piece, though I might make a suggestion about someone that I feel might add to a particular piece of work. Maybe in 2 years after I've got this down pat, while still knowing fully well each day I will learn something new even from those just starting out, I will feel I can be able to critique others...
If your at that point then by all means do so, after all everyday is a day of learning new things along with dealing with the old....
I can tell you this, comments such as " any 3 year old with a box of crayolas could do better" isn't going to win you much influence, respect or any friends
Styl-X Design
Reply #7 Sunday, March 23, 2003 9:06 AM
Reply #7 Sunday, March 23, 2003 9:06 AM
It depends on the comment, personaly I don't really get much negative comments, and I RESPECT it when people say:
this is a nice skin, but maby you should make more animation in this one, cause I don't like the animation.
That is a nice comment, with some ADVICE.
On the other hand you have the stupid noobies who sais:
This is crap!!! this sux, UGLY UGLY UGYL!!!
That are'nt nice comments, and if people post sutch comments, it really hurts, because of the time you've put into it.
Those comments you don't see verry oft, and that's a good thing. You also will never see such a comment posted by people who has made skins theirself, cause if you have done skins yourself, you respect other peopel's work, how laggy it may be.
this is a nice skin, but maby you should make more animation in this one, cause I don't like the animation.
That is a nice comment, with some ADVICE.
On the other hand you have the stupid noobies who sais:
This is crap!!! this sux, UGLY UGLY UGYL!!!
That are'nt nice comments, and if people post sutch comments, it really hurts, because of the time you've put into it.
Those comments you don't see verry oft, and that's a good thing. You also will never see such a comment posted by people who has made skins theirself, cause if you have done skins yourself, you respect other peopel's work, how laggy it may be.
Aaron W.
Reply #8 Sunday, March 23, 2003 9:54 AM
Reply #8 Sunday, March 23, 2003 9:54 AM
I have never made a WB skin, but I can distinguish between something that has been carefully pieced together and something that hasn't. I consider myself a perfectionist to a flaw, almost 
Skins don't have to be perfect to be awesome. I just think that when the XP start menu is illegible, then the artist didn't put much effort into it...
I consider myself a creative person, too. I just don't have the application skills to turn my ideas into actual images yet. No some may call me hypocritical, but I wouldn't, because artistic talent and taste can be sold separately.
And I agree that disrespectful comments which fail to provide any constructive criticism are simply hurtful. Constructive criticism is often misinterpreted, too.
Skins don't have to be perfect to be awesome. I just think that when the XP start menu is illegible, then the artist didn't put much effort into it...I consider myself a creative person, too. I just don't have the application skills to turn my ideas into actual images yet. No some may call me hypocritical, but I wouldn't, because artistic talent and taste can be sold separately.
And I agree that disrespectful comments which fail to provide any constructive criticism are simply hurtful. Constructive criticism is often misinterpreted, too.
jfike
Reply #9 Sunday, March 23, 2003 11:00 AM
Reply #9 Sunday, March 23, 2003 11:00 AM
Maybe there's more to this ... I just downloaded and applied everaldo, and it didn't look very good on my system (winXP, 1600x1200 true color). My display properties menu turned completely black. Start/All Programs menu was black with a medium to dark gray font, which was quite difficult to read. However, the comments for this WB skin seemed quite favorable and nothing I saw suggested the menu problems I had.
So this got me wondering. There's so many factors involved, such as WB version (I'm using the latest non alpha/beta version), screen resolution and number of colors, operating system, screen brightness and contrast, etc.
Anyway, I guess my point is, to judge (comment) you need to be running the configuration that the folks here at WinCustomize use when accepting a skin (or anything else).
So this got me wondering. There's so many factors involved, such as WB version (I'm using the latest non alpha/beta version), screen resolution and number of colors, operating system, screen brightness and contrast, etc.
Anyway, I guess my point is, to judge (comment) you need to be running the configuration that the folks here at WinCustomize use when accepting a skin (or anything else).
JamMeister33
Reply #10 Sunday, March 23, 2003 11:02 AM
Reply #10 Sunday, March 23, 2003 11:02 AM
You should be able to adjust a lot of these settings in the Windowblinds configuration.....
da_zman20
Reply #11 Sunday, March 23, 2003 11:39 AM
Reply #11 Sunday, March 23, 2003 11:39 AM
I just want to say that i've seen every windowblinds skin on this site. None of them are as bad as you say. that is an extreme exaguration. The misalignments and such, well I haven't seen these. Please try and have some class sir, your opinion may differ from everyone elses considering that you have never made a windowblinds skin.
jfike
Reply #12 Sunday, March 23, 2003 11:41 AM
Reply #12 Sunday, March 23, 2003 11:41 AM
That's true. My point was maybe that's why Simon Cowell is my idol comments about skins being "farces" was made. If your system is not set the same way the skins get judged, the skin may look bad.
IPlural
Reply #13 Sunday, March 23, 2003 12:28 PM
, but is it that the skin looks bad, or your system is found to be lacking?
reminds me of two things, one is the moment from A Knights tale were they inform the
evil dude he has been measured and found lacking, and the every end of the movie when they
all fart to see who pays for the round of beer
Reply #13 Sunday, March 23, 2003 12:28 PM
, but is it that the skin looks bad, or your system is found to be lacking?reminds me of two things, one is the moment from A Knights tale were they inform the
evil dude he has been measured and found lacking, and the every end of the movie when they
all fart to see who pays for the round of beer
jake nothing but joking
MrGupps
Reply #16 Sunday, March 23, 2003 2:08 PM
Reply #16 Sunday, March 23, 2003 2:08 PM
Simon C is my idol, as far as i am concerned it is hard enought to get a skin onto WC. I have made over 10 skins that have all been rejected. I dunno maybe i just suck at this. But look at my desktop, if the skins on WC are bad, shouldn't that be on there?
MrGupps
Reply #17 Sunday, March 23, 2003 2:09 PM
Reply #17 Sunday, March 23, 2003 2:09 PM
If the skins on WC are bad, should that have been rejected?*
paxx
Reply #18 Sunday, March 23, 2003 2:31 PM
Reply #18 Sunday, March 23, 2003 2:31 PM
Aaron, first, I see where you're coming from. I agree that a lot, probably as much as 50% of the Windowblinds submited here are average or below average, some of them are even total crap. But, we do not mederate skins. We only moderate wallpapers because if we did not we'd have tens of thousands of wallpapers, which we don't want because this is not a wallpaper site but a skins site. As for the comments, well, a lot of people can't take critique and improvement suggestions, so some of us have stopped giving them. What can I say, it seems some people only submit work so they can be praised and awed, and as soon as one person dare say that the skins isn'ty totally perfect, they freak out.
I personnaly have given up on leaving constructive comments because of that. I suspect a lot of people feel the same.
Fortunately, there is the rating system. While some people dare not leave negative comments, the ratings are anonymous, and therefore crappy skins don't usually get very high ratings. If you choose to sort the skins by ratings, I suspect you'll see a much better selection of skins.
I personnaly have given up on leaving constructive comments because of that. I suspect a lot of people feel the same.
Fortunately, there is the rating system. While some people dare not leave negative comments, the ratings are anonymous, and therefore crappy skins don't usually get very high ratings. If you choose to sort the skins by ratings, I suspect you'll see a much better selection of skins.
MarkMcQ
Reply #19 Sunday, March 23, 2003 3:14 PM
Reply #19 Sunday, March 23, 2003 3:14 PM
I agree with everything Paxx said.
Especially the part regarding people submitting work simply for praise. That seems to be the big thing lately, which is quite sad.
Especially the part regarding people submitting work simply for praise. That seems to be the big thing lately, which is quite sad.
Green Armani
Reply #20 Sunday, March 23, 2003 3:17 PM
Reply #20 Sunday, March 23, 2003 3:17 PM
I agree with paxx.....I would rather get a comment that helps me out then one that says it sucks. Personnaly it doesn't bother me that someone doesn't like it but to actually express that they would rather have their fingers nails ripped off then download my wall...that isn't helping me. I like getting all kinds of comments since I'm pretty much still learning so I use it as a guage, besides you can't please eveyone 
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Reply #1 Sunday, March 23, 2003 8:44 AM
Should we decide to citique them, then we do so in a positive manner tring to provide advice according to our own abilities.
There could be nothing worse than to crush the creative spirit of an aspiring artist through some poorly constucted criticism.
No one here is trying to win a contest, but to simply display their work freely for all.
So we tend to honor and thank them for it.