US is going to war tomarrow... dang...
Sunday, March 16, 2003 by IPlural | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
opps
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wombat_1
Reply #1242 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 9:52 PM
Reply #1242 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 9:52 PM
I'd really like to comment but my 'Freedom of Speech' has been revoked ... 
One answer for Baker, re your question about 'insider information', I could tell you but then I'd have to kill you!
Nah!
Just joshing .... it helps if you wear a uniform at times like this, one knows rather more than the 'Media Drones'!
That will probably get me permanently exiled now.
One answer for Baker, re your question about 'insider information', I could tell you but then I'd have to kill you!
Nah!
Just joshing .... it helps if you wear a uniform at times like this, one knows rather more than the 'Media Drones'!
That will probably get me permanently exiled now.
jennyc
Reply #1243 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 9:54 PM
Reply #1243 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 9:54 PM
Bangkokboy
"I don't EVER want an American Muslum person to feel bad for being themselves in my Country" - jennyc
this reads funny - maybe "my" should be "our".
I have learned early on NEVER to speak for anyone but myself.
It is MY opinion in MY country. That is what makes America Great. Never force my opinion into 'our' opinon...it loses not only its meaning...but it becomes a generalization that not every person of my country may feel or abide by.
"I don't EVER want an American Muslum person to feel bad for being themselves in my Country" - jennyc
this reads funny - maybe "my" should be "our".
I have learned early on NEVER to speak for anyone but myself.
It is MY opinion in MY country. That is what makes America Great. Never force my opinion into 'our' opinon...it loses not only its meaning...but it becomes a generalization that not every person of my country may feel or abide by.
Bangkokboy
Reply #1244 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:00 PM
Reply #1244 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:00 PM
your opinion does not need to be inclusive. your country does.
Jafo
Reply #1245 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:03 PM
Reply #1245 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:03 PM
Xerraire...those who forget the mistakes of history are bound to repeat them...
No-one needs to look forward to predict the future...just look backward and observe its repetition...
No-one needs to look forward to predict the future...just look backward and observe its repetition...
Jafo
Reply #1247 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:06 PM
Reply #1247 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:06 PM
jennyc....'Muslum' WILL make them feel 'bad'.....'Muslim' perhaps will not.... 
or perhaps 'Moslem' [also OK]...
or perhaps 'Moslem' [also OK]...
Xerraire
Reply #1248 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:08 PM
Reply #1248 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:08 PM
Explain to it to me then? The part about the relevancy of the oil here? I mean, what bakerstreet said kinda knocked down what you were saying about how we personally really don't need the oil from Iraq. In fact, its costing us perhaps more than its worth?
I don't mean to sound ignorant, but quotes like mistakes of history and repeating them, just doesn't explain to me your point of view, which I am trying very hard to understand.
I don't mean to sound ignorant, but quotes like mistakes of history and repeating them, just doesn't explain to me your point of view, which I am trying very hard to understand.
kona0197
Reply #1249 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:08 PM
Reply #1249 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:08 PM
Hey Jafo are you rich yet from getting 5 cents for every mis-spell?
BTW kudos Jenny. I'm on your side.
BTW kudos Jenny. I'm on your side.
Jafo
Reply #1250 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:32 PM
Reply #1250 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:32 PM
Xerraire...I'm not saying the 'cost' of the War is to be totally, entirely balanced by the potential 'value' of Oil reserves and/or control, but it MUST be a contributing factor. It [the oil] cannot be ignored and is factored into the overall purpose/expectations of the conflict and its outcome. To claim otherwise is to be naive in the extreme.
A finite, but very, very valuable natural resource can be a tool, a bargaining weapon with rival [to the West] countries...Iraq offers oil, gets WMDs in return, etc.
It is therefore imperative that Saddam's capacity/ability to 'purchase' things we'd all rather he didn't, be curtailed, hence the War.
In all reality, humanitarian issues relating to the plight of the Iraqi people will play second fiddle to the de-clawing of Saddam's potential to Terrorise the West in general, and [grudgingly] a by-product of that is ONLY maybe a slight improvement in the 'lot' of the Arab 'peoples'.
A finite, but very, very valuable natural resource can be a tool, a bargaining weapon with rival [to the West] countries...Iraq offers oil, gets WMDs in return, etc.
It is therefore imperative that Saddam's capacity/ability to 'purchase' things we'd all rather he didn't, be curtailed, hence the War.
In all reality, humanitarian issues relating to the plight of the Iraqi people will play second fiddle to the de-clawing of Saddam's potential to Terrorise the West in general, and [grudgingly] a by-product of that is ONLY maybe a slight improvement in the 'lot' of the Arab 'peoples'.
bakerstreet
Reply #1251 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:42 PM
Reply #1251 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:42 PM
wombat_1: finally... was beginnin to think you had wandered off for good. 
Jafo: In that light, i can agree to a point. The military and political benefits Hussein was on the verge of getting *because* of his oil is a large part of this. Anti-war Europe had been whining about removing sanctions, and if that had happened then he would have bought lots of toys from them. We've already had to deal with a few, sanctions or not.
so, if you are saying this is about what the oil might have bought for him, I'd have to agree with ya.
I don't think we'll have an ounce of leverage after the war, though. The rest of the oil producing nations would never stand for it, they are sour enough about all this as it is. We're fighting Saddam now, I have a feeling we'll be fending off Syria or worse if we abuse our position afterward.
Jafo: In that light, i can agree to a point. The military and political benefits Hussein was on the verge of getting *because* of his oil is a large part of this. Anti-war Europe had been whining about removing sanctions, and if that had happened then he would have bought lots of toys from them. We've already had to deal with a few, sanctions or not.
so, if you are saying this is about what the oil might have bought for him, I'd have to agree with ya.
I don't think we'll have an ounce of leverage after the war, though. The rest of the oil producing nations would never stand for it, they are sour enough about all this as it is. We're fighting Saddam now, I have a feeling we'll be fending off Syria or worse if we abuse our position afterward.
Jafo
Reply #1252 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:52 PM
Reply #1252 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 10:52 PM
Baker...yes, essentially.
Whoever controls that oil and where it goes and what is done with the revenue...THAT is what the War is 'about'.
If only we [as in UK/US/AUS] can get rid of Saddam, so the oil revenue can be used for the Iraqi people.
Places like Bahrain or Kuwait....Oil-rich, pro-West, still Moslem, but able to assimilate well, internationally.
Iraq 'could' be a wealthy, stable nation, doing what more far-seeing Oil nations are doing....looking towards the next 'money crop'....tourism...
Whoever controls that oil and where it goes and what is done with the revenue...THAT is what the War is 'about'.
If only we [as in UK/US/AUS] can get rid of Saddam, so the oil revenue can be used for the Iraqi people.
Places like Bahrain or Kuwait....Oil-rich, pro-West, still Moslem, but able to assimilate well, internationally.
Iraq 'could' be a wealthy, stable nation, doing what more far-seeing Oil nations are doing....looking towards the next 'money crop'....tourism...
bakerstreet
Reply #1253 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 11:01 PM
Reply #1253 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 11:01 PM
Jafo: heck, man, that's Babylon. sheesh, wanna talk historical value? I'd go. Wasn't eden described as being near the Euphrates? How's that for tourist value?
**
GOOD NEWS!
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L02114599.htm
3 of the journalists were released. Score one for paxx. Also the US Rangers and SEALs rescued a female POW that had been listed as MIA. She was in one of those iraqi 'hospitals'. gives me the creeps. no word on the others, though.
**
GOOD NEWS!
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L02114599.htm
3 of the journalists were released. Score one for paxx. Also the US Rangers and SEALs rescued a female POW that had been listed as MIA. She was in one of those iraqi 'hospitals'. gives me the creeps. no word on the others, though.
IPlural
Reply #1254 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 11:20 PM
Reply #1254 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 11:20 PM
they found a number of other missing with her, none alive and they gave no exact number..
JamMeister33
Reply #1255 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 11:29 PM
Reply #1255 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 11:29 PM
I see many valid points being made here and most of them center around the U.S. in a large way profiting from the oil in Iraq... now it is my understanding as the propaganda machine would have me believe that we don't REALLY need their oil at all.. So where is all this Oil for Blood stuff coming from? I believe in the positive intentions of the United States of America in putting down a rabid dog and I am not cynical enough to believe that we are only doing it so that we can gain some major control over just another oil supply of which we have more than enough to draw from already.
jennyc
Reply #1256 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 11:48 PM
Reply #1256 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 11:48 PM
AMEN JamMeister33
With that I'm off to have sweet, safe...dreams because I live protected by some OF THE BRAVEST MEN AND WOMEN ON EARTH.
OH YEAH...USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA!
AMEN AGAIN
WOW...PATRIOTS ARE NOT DEAD
With that I'm off to have sweet, safe...dreams because I live protected by some OF THE BRAVEST MEN AND WOMEN ON EARTH.
OH YEAH...USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA!
AMEN AGAIN
WOW...PATRIOTS ARE NOT DEAD
Jafo
Reply #1258 Wednesday, April 2, 2003 12:06 AM
Reply #1258 Wednesday, April 2, 2003 12:06 AM
jennyc...try to remember that English and Australian troops are there, as well...eg, the Aussies are either SAS deep behind the 'lines' doing their 'thing', or are quietly disarming sea mines....by hand.....nothing 'special', just doing their job...
craeonics
Reply #1259 Wednesday, April 2, 2003 2:36 AM
Reply #1259 Wednesday, April 2, 2003 2:36 AM
Or in other words, you should be yelling "UK" and "Oz" as well.
bakerstreet
Reply #1260 Wednesday, April 2, 2003 3:22 AM
Reply #1260 Wednesday, April 2, 2003 3:22 AM
and in their off-time they clear Iraq of dangerous dingos and throw more prawns on the barby!
G'Day!
G'Day!
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Reply #1241 Tuesday, April 1, 2003 9:51 PM
The implication of what you say and how you answered me is that you seem to be able to tell the future. Or at the very least you really put two and two together and only see one reason for us to be in Iraq...?
Are you sure in that crystal ball of yours there isn't something else to run our vehicles with apart from oil in teh future?