The Skinning Metric!
Sunday, February 16, 2003 by Frogboy | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
It's easy to find out whether interest in customization is increasing or not, just look at site popularity.
But what about in skinning itself? The future popularity of skinning can probably be determined by looking at how many new things are being created.
But if you were going to create an honest and objective metric to try to determine health what apps would you pick?
I'd pick apps that fit these criteria:
a) Have existed for awhile.
Are likely to continue to exist for awhile
c) Are amongst the most popular in their class.
Here are the apps I'm thinking of using:
WindowBlinds
Msstyles
CursorXP
Winamp
WMP
IconPackager
DesktopX
Litestep
Hoverdesk
Talisman (version 2)
Now we could debate on whether say Aston shell should be used or ObjectBar or WinStyles or NeXTStart or Sysmetrix but I'm trying to come up with a list of really core apps that help gauge general interest.
With that in mind, are there any apps that you really REALLY feel should be included? I.e. ones that today already have massive significant popularity and are likely to continue to be there in the YEARS ahead (i.e. have staying power).
But what about in skinning itself? The future popularity of skinning can probably be determined by looking at how many new things are being created.
But if you were going to create an honest and objective metric to try to determine health what apps would you pick?
I'd pick apps that fit these criteria:
a) Have existed for awhile.
Are likely to continue to exist for awhilec) Are amongst the most popular in their class.
Here are the apps I'm thinking of using:
WindowBlinds
Msstyles
CursorXP
Winamp
WMP
IconPackager
DesktopX
Litestep
Hoverdesk
Talisman (version 2)
Now we could debate on whether say Aston shell should be used or ObjectBar or WinStyles or NeXTStart or Sysmetrix but I'm trying to come up with a list of really core apps that help gauge general interest.
With that in mind, are there any apps that you really REALLY feel should be included? I.e. ones that today already have massive significant popularity and are likely to continue to be there in the YEARS ahead (i.e. have staying power).
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Frogboy
Reply #2 Sunday, February 16, 2003 3:55 AM
Reply #2 Sunday, February 16, 2003 3:55 AM
BTW, using WinCustomize, deviantART, DeskMod, and ThemeXP as the sites for benchmarking here are some stats:
Skin Wars:
WindowBlinds: 2791 skins combined
Msstyles: 979
Trend: More skins are being made per month for WindowBlinds
Shell Wars:
Litestep: 589
Hoverdesk: 285
Talisman: 404
Trend: Litestep is king but Talisman is slowly taking over.
Audio wars:
Winamp: 4528
WMP: 309
Trend: Winamp is king of skinning but future uncertain for Winamp 3 skinning. Odd note: Deskmod doesn't support Windows Media Player as far as I can tell (no section).
Websites:
Deskmod just passed its 20,000th submission mark. deviantART its millionth. In terms of skins, DA has roughly 10,000 skins (5500 in this metric), Deskmod has 1,600 skins in this metric and WC has 5200 in the metric. ThemeXP has 614 (all msstyles).
Skin Wars:
WindowBlinds: 2791 skins combined
Msstyles: 979
Trend: More skins are being made per month for WindowBlinds
Shell Wars:
Litestep: 589
Hoverdesk: 285
Talisman: 404
Trend: Litestep is king but Talisman is slowly taking over.
Audio wars:
Winamp: 4528
WMP: 309
Trend: Winamp is king of skinning but future uncertain for Winamp 3 skinning. Odd note: Deskmod doesn't support Windows Media Player as far as I can tell (no section).
Websites:
Deskmod just passed its 20,000th submission mark. deviantART its millionth. In terms of skins, DA has roughly 10,000 skins (5500 in this metric), Deskmod has 1,600 skins in this metric and WC has 5200 in the metric. ThemeXP has 614 (all msstyles).
MarkMcQ
Reply #3 Sunday, February 16, 2003 7:01 AM
Reply #3 Sunday, February 16, 2003 7:01 AM
In a roundabout kinda way, Kaleidoscope should get a mention too.
A lot of WB and MSStyle skinners have ported from there, and it's gotten a bit more recognition in the Windows community.
The BBX stuff is a good example of a popular K-style that made the leap across platforms.
A lot of WB and MSStyle skinners have ported from there, and it's gotten a bit more recognition in the Windows community.
The BBX stuff is a good example of a popular K-style that made the leap across platforms.
Snowman
Reply #4 Sunday, February 16, 2003 8:08 AM
Reply #4 Sunday, February 16, 2003 8:08 AM
Frogboy fyi:
http://www.deskmod.com/?show=showcat&cat_name=wmp7
http://www.deskmod.com/?show=showcat&cat_name=wmp9
http://www.deskmod.com/?show=showcat&cat_name=wmpxp
seems like Deskmod do have wmp sections, they are just listed under "media" instead of "audio"
http://www.deskmod.com/?show=showcat&cat_name=wmp7
http://www.deskmod.com/?show=showcat&cat_name=wmp9
http://www.deskmod.com/?show=showcat&cat_name=wmpxp
seems like Deskmod do have wmp sections, they are just listed under "media" instead of "audio"
moshi
Reply #5 Sunday, February 16, 2003 8:35 AM
Reply #5 Sunday, February 16, 2003 8:35 AM
using only these four sites produces some nice stats, but i would not be too sure if these benchmarks are reliable.
unlike HVD and Talisman, LiteStep skinning never really had it´s base at the general skin sites. the LiteStep community always had and has it´s own "superbowl parties" where the exchange of ideas happens.
currently there are (for downloading themes):
www.litestep.net
www.lsthemes.com
there are also plenty of local sites by enthusiasts all over the world.
also don´t forget winamp.com (the biggest skinning site): it has 48128 Winamp2 skins.
Hippy: Kaleidoscope has been declared dead recently. they closed the scheme archive on January 13.
unlike HVD and Talisman, LiteStep skinning never really had it´s base at the general skin sites. the LiteStep community always had and has it´s own "superbowl parties" where the exchange of ideas happens.
currently there are (for downloading themes):
www.litestep.net
www.lsthemes.com
there are also plenty of local sites by enthusiasts all over the world.
also don´t forget winamp.com (the biggest skinning site): it has 48128 Winamp2 skins.
Hippy: Kaleidoscope has been declared dead recently. they closed the scheme archive on January 13.
Frogboy
Reply #6 Sunday, February 16, 2003 12:16 PM
Reply #6 Sunday, February 16, 2003 12:16 PM
Moshi, good point but remember, the statistics are only relative to one another. As long as the sites are representative of the skin community and popular enough to avoid anomalous behavior it'll do the trick.
The goal is to see if things are improving, declining or remaining the same.
The goal is to see if things are improving, declining or remaining the same.
Jafo
Reply #7 Sunday, February 16, 2003 3:52 PM
Reply #7 Sunday, February 16, 2003 3:52 PM
I vaguely remember the old LS.net site having over 1000 'STEP themes...a few years ago...
Frogboy
Reply #8 Monday, February 17, 2003 2:29 AM
Reply #8 Monday, February 17, 2003 2:29 AM
Precisely. That is why you have to be really careful which sites you choose.
Even ThemeXP is a bit iffy as a metric benchmark because it lost its database last May and hasn't added a skin in a month.
Even ThemeXP is a bit iffy as a metric benchmark because it lost its database last May and hasn't added a skin in a month.
craeonics
Reply #9 Monday, February 17, 2003 3:21 AM
Reply #9 Monday, February 17, 2003 3:21 AM
Even more interesting would be to offset this so called "rise of customisation" against the number of wallpapers/non-skinning material. And factoring out them @#$% ports.
joetheblow
Reply #10 Monday, February 17, 2003 3:50 AM
Reply #10 Monday, February 17, 2003 3:50 AM
I'm a lazy nutcase... what is MSSTLYES?
I think the apps you choose make sence to me
WindowBlinds
Msstyles
CursorXP
Winamp
WMP
IconPackager
DesktopX
Litestep
Hoverdesk
Talisman (version 2)
Not sure why NextStep shouldn't be included.
I love ObjectBar but I see you point as to not adding it (there is only so much you can do with it and doesn't seem to be many skinning it)
I can't think of any more apps. What you have is a good start. I would include winamp.com along with the other sites (deskmod, wincust, deviantart...)
though I wonder, wouldn't become obvious if skinning is getting popular or not by looking ast the amount of visitors?
are you going to include downloads on you list as well as interactivity on the boards?
I think the apps you choose make sence to me
WindowBlinds
Msstyles
CursorXP
Winamp
WMP
IconPackager
DesktopX
Litestep
Hoverdesk
Talisman (version 2)
Not sure why NextStep shouldn't be included.
I love ObjectBar but I see you point as to not adding it (there is only so much you can do with it and doesn't seem to be many skinning it)
I can't think of any more apps. What you have is a good start. I would include winamp.com along with the other sites (deskmod, wincust, deviantart...)
though I wonder, wouldn't become obvious if skinning is getting popular or not by looking ast the amount of visitors?
are you going to include downloads on you list as well as interactivity on the boards?
craeonics
Reply #11 Monday, February 17, 2003 3:56 AM
Reply #11 Monday, February 17, 2003 3:56 AM
MS Styles = XP's theme system, either via cracking uxtheme.dll or an app called StylesXP.
Microsoft had the bright idea of not making their system open for everyone, so people had to be creative.
Microsoft had the bright idea of not making their system open for everyone, so people had to be creative.
joetheblow
Reply #12 Monday, February 17, 2003 4:07 AM
Reply #12 Monday, February 17, 2003 4:07 AM
oh... ok. I guess they where just trying to protect thier design... like Macintosh GUI. I wonder why they didn't go afer them yet for hacking into thier stuffus?
anyway....
hey, and maybe have a catagory for "mini apps" and clog a bunch of apps that are not big but sure to last a long time.
Sysmetrix
Logons
those note taking programs
coolPlayer
Mozilla skins
and see if there are more "mini apps" or less "mini apps" coming out and how many skins they have and how many downloads
anyway....
hey, and maybe have a catagory for "mini apps" and clog a bunch of apps that are not big but sure to last a long time.
Sysmetrix
Logons
those note taking programs
coolPlayer
Mozilla skins
and see if there are more "mini apps" or less "mini apps" coming out and how many skins they have and how many downloads
DavidK
Reply #13 Monday, February 17, 2003 4:10 AM
Reply #13 Monday, February 17, 2003 4:10 AM
I would include NextStart, and maybe ICQ Plus but I don't know how active those apps are now. I just know they were definitly 'core' apps not long ago.
Sysmetrix seems to be growing in popularity and has an impressive 236 skins here already in its short life. Since most of the skins are fairly intricate and it seems to be the system meter of choice now I imagine it will be around for a long time. I've seen screenshots where the only skins used were Sysmetrix and that calendar program (Reindaller?).
Sysmetrix seems to be growing in popularity and has an impressive 236 skins here already in its short life. Since most of the skins are fairly intricate and it seems to be the system meter of choice now I imagine it will be around for a long time. I've seen screenshots where the only skins used were Sysmetrix and that calendar program (Reindaller?).
joetheblow
Reply #14 Monday, February 17, 2003 5:01 AM
Reply #14 Monday, February 17, 2003 5:01 AM
Riendaller (spell?) whould be the other "mini app"
moshi
Reply #18 Monday, February 17, 2003 8:00 AM
Reply #18 Monday, February 17, 2003 8:00 AM
here´s proof: http://vapaa.dc.inet.fi/~rainy/Rainlendar.html
Chris
Reply #20 Monday, February 17, 2003 10:29 AM
Reply #20 Monday, February 17, 2003 10:29 AM
I'd also include Winstep (NextStart and Workshelf) as well.
What about Trillian? I don't know if it meets your criteria of "been around awhile" but I think it certainly meets the other criteria
What about Trillian? I don't know if it meets your criteria of "been around awhile" but I think it certainly meets the other criteria
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Reply #1 Sunday, February 16, 2003 3:51 AM