Do we really know what respect means?
Wednesday, February 19, 2014 by TomRichter | Discussion: Community
Folks, I know that I am not poking around regularly (being busy about a lot of stuff beyond computer world), but I just couldn't stand that bitter feeling inside. So the question is what has happened? A pure and easy answer: A lack of respect has - around this site. Before making anyone think of me I am a freak, let me give you just couple of words how I have come to this.
There's a growing portion of people here (talk to me I am wrong) thinking that being explicit is always good by all means. In which case that is perfectly fine provided those folks feel some respect to others. Example, an easy one? A criticism. Giving a criticism is a way how to express satisfactory or not satisfactory feelings about something, right. It's not from my head. And now here is the point. A couple of years ago when I joined the site it was very natural that when people felt a compulsion to criticize, they did but with a due respect. Like: "Hey, I like what you did. But not everything. There are some areas appaling and not consistent and bla bla bla."
These days examples: "Hey, the skin sucks" or "You are putting out a plenty of skins but they are all the same sh.t". Now I am not kidding.
When releasing my first and (for time being the last) master skin I received a couple of messages on to my personal email saying:
example: "Your skins just suck, how dare you put them out for money?" or "Man, everything on the internet is almost free. What are you trying to show here by selling this crap. If it were for free I would give it a go, but for money, c'mon."
Now I am not joking, folks. I just did tell myself it's not worth a thread those days. And now I have seen some comments on Lighstar's WB release and I just recall that bitterness. And you can see this on forums too, can't you?
And it's not only about Ligstar or me or anybody else. I am sure a lot of folks know that feel. It's about the fact, that in passing years we somehow forgot about being nice or constructive in thinking or criticisms. We simply have lost the respect. Surely being nice does not cost anything.
There are a lot of folks around releasing regularly. They needn't be the best at what they do. But they try their best. Sometimes that is not a bad thing to give more support than letting those down. If we don't like their works but at the same time we have a feeling to criticize we can do it with respect.
Reply #2 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 7:29 PM
Good thread, however, if anyone has seen the 'standard' of criticism here over the years it's the Admins/mods ....and you can take it from me that what can be called 'nasty negativity' has been around since day one.
What will have changed, however is the authors of same will not still be around.
When it comes to the commercial status of skins/skinning attracting vitriolic comments the FIRST example was from an 'admin' [use term loosely] from Customize.org ....and his target was treetog and Alexandrie. When? ....about 2001.
I have a bunch of old 'texts' I found the other day....some of which are old for want of a better word, 'comments' on skins. First I had saved the text...then deleted the comment...then deleted the person.
I 'could' post them [they're quite old] however the wording would offend every minority/creed/sex/race/whatever.... one or the other.
Usually it's also bad English...so teachers might be upset too....
When it happens [and it always will] it is dealt with....one way or another...
Reply #3 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 7:38 PM
Unfortunately, there will always be rude and obnoxious people in the world, especially when they are safely on the other side of a computer screen where they can slash and dash.
Just ignore them Tom, who cares what they think. Most folk around here appreciate the skins you produce. The best revenge you can have on people like that is to bring your kids up to respect and be kind to others. Something that these trolls obviously never learned from their parents.
Reply #4 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 7:52 PM
I must agree with your observation. If I offer criticism I try to always mean it as constructive and motivating. There is no place for the plain "That Sucks" kind of comment and the people that make them.
On another side of the coin I see more authors that cant take criticism of ANY KIND AT ALL. Even well formed and valid criticism. IMO, there is no place for that kind of "skinner" either as their ego's suck all the fun out of an otherwise enjoyable activity.
Reply #5 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 8:12 PM
Reply #6 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 8:14 PM
It may be a bit old fashion but I've have always tried to follow the rule 'Treat others as you would like to be treated', at times a very hard rule to follow but best for all if you can.
Reply #7 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 8:23 PM
Forgot to add...the first person to cop flak re getting an income from skinning was Brad.....and that'd date back beyond the first time I got into skinning and found that better-than-eFX-thing called 'Windowblinds' . [that'd be around '98] ....
Reply #8 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 8:25 PM
I do not see my name in the OP, why do I feel guilty [e digicons]:'([/e] is this about how good I am at everything.
K, miss your skinning Tom, and even if I have contributed to the dark side of commenting, I try to be nice most times and know what you are saying.
Also, as Jafo said , although I am not as old as him, not even close,lol, I am sure rudeness is nothing new.
That delete button he has probably isn't either. Move your hand away slowly please, no false deletions!
Reply #9 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 8:47 PM
Tom, I miss your skins as well, and I hope you continue here. We need more like you, and I, for one, have all the respect in the world for you and your talent.
Reply #10 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 9:21 PM
Well, I looked back into my 'archives'....the issue re Custo.org and commercial skins dates back to 2002 [April]
...and here's the oldest snippet of 'respectful' comment I kept....it's dated August 2002.
....and let's face it....arguably things are better.....now....
YOUR ALL FAGGOTS CANT YOU SEE THAT THIS COULD BE A WORK OF ART... IN A FUCKEN PRIMARY SCHOOL????? ARE YOU A FUKEN 3 YEAR OLD JESUS CHRIST WAT THE FUCK IS THIS PICTURE ANYWAY? ITS LIKE CHINATOWN MEETS "CARLITUS" WHAT A FUKEN DUMB-CUNT OF A NAME HAHAHAHAHA THIS PICTURE !STILL! MAKES ME VOMIT MATE
AND "WIZOP KOOP" OR WATEVER THE FUCK UR NAME IS, GO FUCK YOUR SELF THIS IS A FREE COUNTRY NOT LIKE "CARLITUS'S" COUNTRY LIKE INDIA OR BRAZIL OR THOSE FUCKED UP CONTRIES
GO BACK TO PRIMARY SCHOOL DICKHEAD!!!!!!!
P.S. (I WOULD TAKE THIS ADVICE BECAUSE... UMMM... DAMN THIS IS SHIT)
ANYWAYZ MABEY YOU ARE RETARDED OR SOMETHING SO HAHAHAHAHA I HATE DISABLED PEOPLE TRYING TO MAKE THEMSELVES POPULAR
by Citizen steven smith - 8/4/2002 8:03:26 AM
I simply HAD TO delete it....afterall....he was shouting...
I did say it/they would offend just about every race/creed/sex/etc ....
Reply #11 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 9:24 PM
LOL!!! Tourettes Guy lives!!!
Reply #12 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 9:31 PM
No one is as old as Jafo. Maybe God.
Reply #15 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 9:47 PM
Meanwhile...I'm off for a few days....World Superbikes at Phillip Island so I'll be watching things that go vroom-vroom....
[my other job.... of 3]...
Reply #17 Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:42 AM
When a critique isn't constructive? Delete it or don't even bother with it. Let it slide.
Just ask some people whose opinion you respect what they think of whatever it is you created (even though such a group exists - Gallery Moderation).
Hope all's well with the family.
Reply #18 Thursday, February 20, 2014 6:44 AM
I think one of my fav stupid comments is "your blind broke/crashed my computer".
Reply #19 Thursday, February 20, 2014 7:37 AM
Tom, mate i always asked my true friends wether it be in private msg or did a post to get feed back and i can't. Skin for nuts lol but i give it a go . I found most of the people here are great and offered advice at times which helped me to try harder and do better .. There is always going to be a prick or to that will be rude, i look at it this way the person may not have ever skinned in his life or he can't do it due to never tried.
Reply #20 Thursday, February 20, 2014 9:33 AM
I know exactly how you feel Tom as you well know as I am mentioned in your original post. I have gotten emails also that were extremely rude.
It is tough to read those kind of remarks for sure, but after I reply to them (usually but not always politely, depending on the remark) I forget about them completely, they are not worth getting upset over. If they feel that way, they are probably lifelong losers, and always will be. I feel sorry for them in a way.
My designs are what I like and others can like them or not, doesn't matter to me. If I get constructive remarks I sometimes incorporate them in future designs even. There are plenty of skins on this site that I don't care for, but I would never tell the author that. Only if a skin has issues do I mention it to the author, and usually in an email or PM. I used to mention the problem by posting a remark in the past, but no more.
Personally, I wish the comments on skins at WC would be turned off completely, they are really not necessary.
All in all, we cannot control other peoples remarks, but we can certainly ignore them.
I certainly hope to see more skins from you Tom, and lately I have seen skins coming in from newer authors that are really quite good, and hope to see many more from them in the future also.
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Reply #1 Wednesday, February 19, 2014 7:22 PM
Tom....I've seen this stuff for a long time...in fact one of the first comments I ever got was along those lines. I just blew it off. It's really isn't worth mulling over it. You have to remember that once you connected that computer to the internet you were exposing yourself to the best and worst humanity and the internet had to offer. And in doing so you need to grow a thicker skin and really not let things like your talking about get under your skin. I know your first gut feeling is to strangle whoever left the comment...but in the end it's just not worth it.
It's hard enough getting respect in the real world...on the internet....well....good luck with that.