Mac user obnoxiousness

Tuesday, October 1, 2002 by Frogboy | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk

http://www.macobserver.com/article/2002/09/30.14.shtml

I don't really like Macs or more to the point, I can't think of Macs without thinking of Mac users.

Mac users sincerely believe that everything good and nice on the UI came from the mind of Apple first.

The latest example is WindowFX where Mac bigots seem to think that they invented this stuff. WindowFX came out before Aqua. And if someone wants to find what program inspired WindowFX more than anything else it was NPS/WPS from OS/2 which came out years ago (it had shadows, morphing of windows on min/max, etc.).

Apple does get credit for making cool effects famous but that's not the same as having invented it.

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Carlitus
Reply #1 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 3:59 PM
Apple (with their Mac interface) is not the most innovative on GUIs designs. It always coppies features available on other systems:

-For example, The dock is based on Next dock, and it is releasod on OSX due to high demand by users for a taskbar (like in Windows).


That it makes great OSX (and earlier Mac OS versions) is the usability, the well implemented GUI functions, and the consistency between aplications. Of course, it make always well and beauty designed designs. This is true! > But Apple have great problems for mass acceptation:

-Their hardware are very expensive (if you not purchase a monitor-supplied computer, you need to pay a 2000$ computer!). Yes, they are very beauty, but most of the users have a monitor.

-There's not a lot of programs for Mac . And the programs you find in other platforms (such xmms, Sonique, etc.) are shareware, you need to pay for them! BTW, when there's a sufficient set of programs for Mac, Apple changes the computer architecture (from 68k to PowerPC, from Mac Binary to Carbon, from Carbon to Unix-Cocoa), that means a reprogramation of all software available. This is not good.

-The Apple support: Apple computers are hardware-clossed (in theory), and you need to get support from Apple or affiliates. 3 months after purchase, you loses the support, and you need to pay for support (not if you are friend of a supplier). This is not a drama, because the Macs are normal PC's (overprized) with a motherboard, a CPU and a graphic card specially made for Apple operative Systems; all other components are the same for windows: ide, scsii, usb, cdr, you can also try to install a PC radeon and install the drivers! But a normal user don't knows this, and some PC vendors always says: 'sorry i completely unknow the Macs'. Macs are expensive if you have problems too (in opinion of most users).

-A part the contrary propaganda of lots of PC vendors to Apple products.

And the last and very TRUE:

-Mac users are very prepotent, specially to Windoze users.


I'm a Windows & Mac user, actually with booth platforms on my desktop. I said windows shadows and animations using WindowFX prior to the first Aqua screenshot, and DesktopX have more featuresd than Aqua interface, but i repeat:

That it makes great OSX (and earlier Mac OS versions) is the usability and the consistency

If some Mac user says:
'Apple always invent GUIS features'
don't listen to it, and say:
'Please, do you know cumputers GUI history?'
'Do you know Xerox?' - 'And GEM?' - 'And Amiga's?'
'And NeXT?'
'ANd the horrendous taskbar at bootom of Windoze screens?'

I listen always you opinions here, on Internet, and any day i listen the opinion of this kind of Mac users, and i always says to them the Tips and the Secrets of Mac OS and their programs.

Your computer is not better than other that costs the half you spended, and two times faster.


brazil
Reply #2 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 4:07 PM
Hot durn!!!A Mac Bashing!!!!

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bakerstreet
Reply #3 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 4:53 PM
get a rope...

lol. Mac users are a underappreciated minority. They go to the store and they have a teeeeny software section. They want a computer, they buy it at retail, while the geeks they know are off buying affordable parts at the shows. Like any underappreciated minority, they have huge egos pinned to their sleeve and have lots to prove to anyone that will listen. I don't. I have been around mac bigots since I worked for a small local newspaper in ~1990. They are the "designers', the 'artsy' non-technical people.

Go to Slashdot and tell them that XP is better any flavor of Linux and you'll wish you were arguing with a Mac person. Mac people believe in user-friendliness. Linux people believe in cryptic environments to ward off the uninitiated.

I think we Windows pleebs fall right in-between. I ignore the extremes in both directions, and at the same time envy them their lack of dependance on Unkle Bill and his nazi-esque need to annex my PC... There are those strange times in history, though, where revolutionary things happen, forcably moving all us moderate folks to a side. I have a feeling if Palladium is half as annoying as it sounds I'll be in one or the other extremist camp soon enough...

Carlitus
Reply #4 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 5:52 PM
make the love not the war

MarkMcQ
Reply #5 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 5:57 PM
Wait, it's ok. The article clearly mentions that they're talking about the other Stardock that makes WFX. You know, the one in California.......

Snowman
Reply #6 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 6:37 PM
[MAC] - Much Annoyed Component
.....enuff said

jarget
Reply #7 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 6:45 PM
Keep the Peace my Bruthas and Sistas.

We all can get along in this vast Universe of ours.

Power To The People...
XP People that is.

mormegil
Reply #8 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 7:06 PM
I just got a new dual 1 gig Mack 3weeks ago, I have used it to record some audio, and to watch a few DVDs whale I got reel work don on my PC. I decided to buy it because in the industries I am in I meet allot of mac bigots, and I need to be able to talk the language. But I can say. After buying the top of the line Mac. I sure as hell will never switch. I am also, as I use it more and more, and as I deal with Apple more and more, Apple has just about convinced me to never buy another one.

For every cool thing 1 find in OS-X I find 3 that piss me off. It is quite annoying that the company that for years went buy "Think Different" really should be saying "Think the way we want you to" I could have built 3 PC's for the price of this machine. And it sure has not wowed me.

I have been thinking of doing a blog on the topic of "Can Apple Make Me (A PC Graphic Designer) Switch)" So far it dose not seem like it.

Frogboy
Reply #9 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 8:00 PM
Mac users (the zealots I speak of here) are generally the most close minded group of computer users. They are completely unaware of what seems to happen in the outside.

Whenever a feature gets to them after being available elsewhere for years, they lay claim to it as if they invented it.

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DavidK
Reply #10 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 8:09 PM
Didn't Apple copyright (or patent?) the concept of skinning?

I'm happy to see Apple's stranglehold on the publishing/printing industry is finally being challenged. Lately I've seen a few Mac zealots eyeing the wealth of PC clones and programs with more than a little envy. I doubt any true zealot could get over their hatred of Windows though...

jtfolden
Reply #11 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 9:27 PM
I think you'll find there are zealots, OS bigots, and the occasional outright idiotic fringe group in existence for just about every remotely popular operating system/ environment available. Some people tend to be the same about their computers as they are about everything else in life - cars, sex, religion, Star Wars, whatever - their choice just *has* to be the 'one true way'. (Personally I think Linux zealots, and the few straggling OS/2 users left are mucho, mucho worse than any Mac zealot I've met yet).

I happen to be a Mac user, just under 18 months now. I have absolutely no wish or desire to return to Windows. I can't think of a single thing I miss since the 'switch'. I CAN think of a TRUCKLOAD of things I'd miss if I switched back so I guess in the last year and a half I've succumbed to Steve's RDF (Reality Distortion Field) and joined the Apple/NeXT Collective... or I've just finally found the best set of tools available for the way I work and am feeling a bit happy with it. Either way, I guess I'm part of the family now, one of those dreaded, zombie 'mac users' mentioned above - despite the fact that I don't much care who invented what first, or what anyone else might be using.

A couple comments, though...

Carlitus, you can't very well say that OS X "copied" the NeXT dock because OS X isn't much more than NeXTSTEP rebuilt with new features and some pretty plastic surgery. It's OPENSTEP v6.x more or less (with Rhapsody/OS X Server 1 being OPENSTEP 5.x). In fact, at least as late OS X 10.1 there were still some old
NeXT image files laying around in the directory structure. Apple is under NeXT management now, afterall.

Also, I often hear people talk about the Mac not having a lot of apps available and I'm afraid I just don't feel the pinch here. I can certainly see the 'lack of apps' problem with Linux or Be and I felt really deprived when I was running OS/2 but I'm not wanting for anything on the Mac... Hell, Apple iApps alone (like iTunes, iDVD) are worth the price of admission.

messybuu
Reply #12 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 9:49 PM
Some of those comments (about WindowFX being the successor to WindowBlinds and Stardock being based in California) reminds me of Adequacy.org. It's a shame it's no longer in existance.

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mormegil
Reply #13 Tuesday, October 1, 2002 10:27 PM
My fascination with the iApps lasted about 1 day, then I realized I can do all the same things, but with more options and more flexibility on the PC. The straw that brock the camels back was when I realized that IPhoto wold not manage pictures unless they are in the Iphoto folder. I will take XP Any-day, And Like I said, I have an shinny new dual G4 sitting behind me right now. Turned off as usual.

Mr Benn
Reply #14 Wednesday, October 2, 2002 4:35 AM
Interesting that Mac Observer chose to quote some parts of the Register article, but not the bit that says "... even on old hardware ... WindowFX performs snappily. Which is more than can be said for Aqua on all but the latest Apple hardware". I suppose their brains just filtered that line out as it did not fit with their view of the world.

Carlitus
Reply #15 Wednesday, October 2, 2002 8:23 AM
oh well, if i'm a Mac zealot...
i'm a Windows customizing zealot too
or not?

I'm happy with my Wintel, and i'm happy with my Mac. Maybe i prefer the Mac, due to intensive use on my work, but i'm using more Windows at home, due to WIndows customization, and for gaming too.

Carlitus
Reply #16 Wednesday, October 2, 2002 8:28 AM
ok, there's a recent article about computer (Mac) interfaces:
http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,55305,00.html

Carlitus
Reply #17 Wednesday, October 2, 2002 8:31 AM
sorry copy and paste the link (...)
'http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,55305,00.html'

paxx
Reply #18 Wednesday, October 2, 2002 8:33 AM
Bah, minorities have always and will always be on the defensive. They have to prove that although they are a small number, that they are just as important (actually, they try to convince themselves they are MORE important).
Get yourself a small group of brown-haired people and go live in a country where everybody ha blond hair, and I think you'll end up with a similar behavior.
I think it's a natural reflex. Some way to feel better about oneself. Any psychologist in the room?

Carlitus
Reply #19 Wednesday, October 2, 2002 8:34 AM
shit! I hope this time wil be OK:
wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,55305,00.html

copy+paste , if don't work, add the World WIde Web prefix >

messybuu
Reply #20 Wednesday, October 2, 2002 10:00 AM
mormegil: And Like I said, I have an shinny new dual G4 sitting behind me right now. Turned off as usual.
I could take that G4 off your hands for you.

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