3d studio
Wednesday, June 26, 2002 by _Coolballer | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
just wandering how many of you use 3d studio?
 |
|
Page 2 of 4 | |
|
|---|
Firestorm
Reply #22 Friday, July 5, 2002 8:00 PM
Reply #22 Friday, July 5, 2002 8:00 PM
ok, so if you didn't intend to BUY the game, it's ok to copy it and still enjoy the work of the people who made the game, and who rely on its sales to make a living? Nice logic there, champ.
Just because you don't physically take a copy of the game from a store shelf doesn't make it any less of a crime. I know it's hard for warez kids to wrap their ant-sized brains around this one, but: INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY IS JUST AS PROTECTED BY LAW AS MATERIAL PROPERTY.
Copying a software program is just as bad as taking the boxed game from a store shelf. Yes, even if you "weren't gonna buy it anyway."
The people who make these games hope that the quality of the game will attract people to buy it, even those who "weren't going to." Making copies of it discourages people from buying, even those who "weren't going to" but who might have eventually decided to buy it.
Just because you don't physically take a copy of the game from a store shelf doesn't make it any less of a crime. I know it's hard for warez kids to wrap their ant-sized brains around this one, but: INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY IS JUST AS PROTECTED BY LAW AS MATERIAL PROPERTY.
Copying a software program is just as bad as taking the boxed game from a store shelf. Yes, even if you "weren't gonna buy it anyway."
The people who make these games hope that the quality of the game will attract people to buy it, even those who "weren't going to." Making copies of it discourages people from buying, even those who "weren't going to" but who might have eventually decided to buy it.
Vanilla Ice
Reply #23 Friday, July 5, 2002 8:33 PM
Reply #23 Friday, July 5, 2002 8:33 PM
well i can either not have the program and give them no money or i can have it and give them no money, so either way they aren't losing, but if i have it then i've gained someting so it's not a hard choice...
Chris
Reply #24 Friday, July 5, 2002 8:54 PM
Reply #24 Friday, July 5, 2002 8:54 PM
So is there ever a situation in which you WOULD buy the software rather than just use a warez version of it?
Chris
Reply #25 Friday, July 5, 2002 9:01 PM
Reply #25 Friday, July 5, 2002 9:01 PM
Or let me put it this way. Do you postulate then, in general, that a software company should not be compenstated for the resources they put into creating the software and compensated for its use by people?
Firestorm
Reply #26 Friday, July 5, 2002 9:10 PM
Reply #26 Friday, July 5, 2002 9:10 PM
"well i can either not have the program and give them no money or i can have it and give them no money, so either way they aren't losing, but if i have it then i've gained someting so it's not a hard choice..."
The product is offered in the hopes that it will sell. Basic economy. If you don't want to buy it, it is hoped that wanting the program will eventually lead to you changing your mind about buying it. That's how developers make a living, know what I mean? That's why copying it is illegal, yes, even if you "weren't going to buy it."
There's no ands, ifs, or buts: You can agree to the sales terms offered by the software publisher, or you can do without the program. What you're NOT allowed to do is make yourself a copy because you "weren't gonna buy it." Nope, it's not legal, or right. Please stop making excuses. The "I wasn't gonna get it anyway" is a popular argument, but it's flawed. You can't say with all certainty that you wouldn't have bought the program at any point in the future if you hadn't copied it.
The product is offered in the hopes that it will sell. Basic economy. If you don't want to buy it, it is hoped that wanting the program will eventually lead to you changing your mind about buying it. That's how developers make a living, know what I mean? That's why copying it is illegal, yes, even if you "weren't going to buy it."
There's no ands, ifs, or buts: You can agree to the sales terms offered by the software publisher, or you can do without the program. What you're NOT allowed to do is make yourself a copy because you "weren't gonna buy it." Nope, it's not legal, or right. Please stop making excuses. The "I wasn't gonna get it anyway" is a popular argument, but it's flawed. You can't say with all certainty that you wouldn't have bought the program at any point in the future if you hadn't copied it.
WOM
Reply #27 Friday, July 5, 2002 9:35 PM
Reply #27 Friday, July 5, 2002 9:35 PM
Guy's, like I've said before: He's justified it in his mind, so nothing is going to change it. This is probably how he goes thru life. I can use this, let me take it, let me borrow it, I wasn't going to buy it anyway. I just need it for a while. I wonder how much he has that he didn't pay for. I guess he paid for his car because thats different.
kith
Reply #28 Friday, July 5, 2002 10:25 PM
Reply #28 Friday, July 5, 2002 10:25 PM
Vanilla,
Let's just assume for a moment that you code programs for living. Your spouse and children depend on your income to eat and live. Some idiot hacks into your server and downloads your program to "try it out". The next thing you know it's floating all over the internet and now everyone is "trying it out". Sales naturally drop. You lose your job because the company can't afford to pay you. If you don't think it can happen, you've been in a black hole the past few years.
How about this, you hack into a bank's server and transfer a million dollars into a bank account you have set up in the Caymans. You call Martha Stewart's stock broker who has a hot tip for you.
You do some serious day trading and make a killing. You then hack back into the bank before the end of the day and transfer the million back in. Does the bank really lose anything, not really. Is this ethicly wrong or illegal? You better start running buddy... 
Let's just assume for a moment that you code programs for living. Your spouse and children depend on your income to eat and live. Some idiot hacks into your server and downloads your program to "try it out". The next thing you know it's floating all over the internet and now everyone is "trying it out". Sales naturally drop. You lose your job because the company can't afford to pay you. If you don't think it can happen, you've been in a black hole the past few years.
How about this, you hack into a bank's server and transfer a million dollars into a bank account you have set up in the Caymans. You call Martha Stewart's stock broker who has a hot tip for you.
You do some serious day trading and make a killing. You then hack back into the bank before the end of the day and transfer the million back in. Does the bank really lose anything, not really. Is this ethicly wrong or illegal? You better start running buddy... 
Vanilla Ice
Reply #29 Friday, July 5, 2002 11:40 PM
Reply #29 Friday, July 5, 2002 11:40 PM
actually i do code programs. not for a living yet as i just made my first program a week or two ago, but now i do know what it's like being on the other end and it still doesn't bother me. that's because i know that anyone who will take the time to search for a crack for my program probably wouldn't have bought it anyways. in fact i've given out a few serials for some people on a warez forum i goto because i know they won't buy it but would like to have it anyways. most software sales goto businesses, not people who have a normal job and just use the software as entertainment or as kind of a hobby, like me for example.
and since you all like making up scenarious how about this one: a new cd comes out that you want to buy, but you also want the new shirt for that artist too. well you've only got enough money for one or the other and they both cost about the same. so do you buy one of them and do without the other or do you download the cd and buy the shirt? well, that's what i did not too long ago cause i figure by buying the shirt instead i am promoting the artist like a walking advertisement and therefore the artist sells more copies of the cd. my name Vanilla Ice is taken from the artist and as most of you probably know he's a has-been joke that nobody likes, and i didn't liked him either... until i actually listened to the music one day. but not thinking i would like it a whole lot i downloaded the cd. now he's one of my favorite artists and i've bought his new cd as well as two shirts, i run a sorta-popular fansite, and i'm a member of the street team. my point is that when i don't buy something and it turns out to be worth it i make up for it. ther have been cds that i've downloaded weeks before they come out in stores and then later i delete the mp3s and buy the cd.
so say i'm wrong or whatever you want, i couldn't care less.
and since you all like making up scenarious how about this one: a new cd comes out that you want to buy, but you also want the new shirt for that artist too. well you've only got enough money for one or the other and they both cost about the same. so do you buy one of them and do without the other or do you download the cd and buy the shirt? well, that's what i did not too long ago cause i figure by buying the shirt instead i am promoting the artist like a walking advertisement and therefore the artist sells more copies of the cd. my name Vanilla Ice is taken from the artist and as most of you probably know he's a has-been joke that nobody likes, and i didn't liked him either... until i actually listened to the music one day. but not thinking i would like it a whole lot i downloaded the cd. now he's one of my favorite artists and i've bought his new cd as well as two shirts, i run a sorta-popular fansite, and i'm a member of the street team. my point is that when i don't buy something and it turns out to be worth it i make up for it. ther have been cds that i've downloaded weeks before they come out in stores and then later i delete the mp3s and buy the cd.
so say i'm wrong or whatever you want, i couldn't care less.
Vanilla Ice
Reply #30 Friday, July 5, 2002 11:42 PM
Reply #30 Friday, July 5, 2002 11:42 PM
one last thing, you do know that some artist actually support file-sharing services don't you? well, how do you explain that one?
Jafo
Reply #31 Saturday, July 6, 2002 12:58 AM
Reply #31 Saturday, July 6, 2002 12:58 AM
Vanilla Ice.
This is a heads-up.
Firstly, the 'promotion' of Warez use on this site is not acceptable, no matter what 'justification' you may think you have.
Either desist, or leave.
This site is by and for Artists, both skinning and wallpaper varieties, and we take copyright abuse and/or theft quite personally.
Kazaa, just like Napster, and all the others is predominantly being abused by the on-line Warez mentality who have absolutly no regard for, or are totally ignorant of, property theft issues and those pertaining to the unlawful reproduction and distribution of Private Property.
Consider this a polite warning...
This is a heads-up.
Firstly, the 'promotion' of Warez use on this site is not acceptable, no matter what 'justification' you may think you have.
Either desist, or leave.
This site is by and for Artists, both skinning and wallpaper varieties, and we take copyright abuse and/or theft quite personally.
Kazaa, just like Napster, and all the others is predominantly being abused by the on-line Warez mentality who have absolutly no regard for, or are totally ignorant of, property theft issues and those pertaining to the unlawful reproduction and distribution of Private Property.
Consider this a polite warning...
Firestorm
Reply #32 Saturday, July 6, 2002 1:57 AM
Reply #32 Saturday, July 6, 2002 1:57 AM
"one last thing, you do know that some artist actually support file-sharing services don't you? well, how do you explain that one?"
If they own the rights to the music, they can do whatever they want with it. But that doesn't mean all artists feel the same way about THEIR work.
If I take a program I wrote and make it freeware, that doesn't mean you can go and download Jafo's program, for example. Every author has the right to do with their work as they see fit.
If they own the rights to the music, they can do whatever they want with it. But that doesn't mean all artists feel the same way about THEIR work.
If I take a program I wrote and make it freeware, that doesn't mean you can go and download Jafo's program, for example. Every author has the right to do with their work as they see fit.
Vanilla Ice
Reply #33 Saturday, July 6, 2002 1:59 AM
Reply #33 Saturday, July 6, 2002 1:59 AM
alright, no problem. i'm not trying to promote anything or whatever i've just been trying to explain how i personally feel that there's nothing wrong with it under certain cirumstances, but if you all don't agree or if there's a rule about mentioning warez then i won't mention it anymore.
Jafo
Reply #34 Saturday, July 6, 2002 2:59 AM
Reply #34 Saturday, July 6, 2002 2:59 AM
Yes, there IS a 'rule', and it's one of the sorts of 'rules' that isn't to be broken.
Vanilla Ice
Reply #35 Saturday, July 6, 2002 1:17 PM
Reply #35 Saturday, July 6, 2002 1:17 PM
i'll say one more thing before i go and that's that it seems hypocritical to me for a site to outlaw the mentioning of warez when it benifits so much from it. i remember not too long ago the poll asked something about who has object desktop or windowblinds or something and i think around 10% of people admitted to having a pirated copy. and i guarantee you that at least 10% of the themes on this website are made with pirated software. i alone have five skins available now with total downloads nearing 8,000, plus another theme i had for desktop x which made it into the top 10 themes and was downloaded a few thousand times in the week or so that it was available (it was removed for breaking some rule). my themes were made with a pirated copy of a graphics program and i know lots of other themes on this site are too. so then you all have a subscription service which gives people access to these skins, and you all make money off of them, not to mention the ads at the top of the pages. stardock makes more money because with the skins made from pirated software because there are more skins and so more reasons for people to buy stardock products.
migellito
Reply #36 Saturday, July 6, 2002 2:21 PM
Reply #36 Saturday, July 6, 2002 2:21 PM
the subscriptions are not a money making thing.. it'd be nice if they were.. lol.. but they're not. it's just one more element working toward the site supporting itself. the kind of bandwidth in use here is verrrry pricey.
Frogboy
Reply #38 Saturday, July 6, 2002 8:25 PM
Reply #38 Saturday, July 6, 2002 8:25 PM
If someone wants to debate warez that's okay with me. Just don't give links or tell people where to get them.
Similarly, if someone wants to argue that doing drugs is a good thing, that's fine too, just don't tell people where you get yours.
Vanilla Ice's point is valid: If he wouldn't buy the software anyway, how is he hurting anyone? That is the case with any intellectual property.
No reasonable person will claim that piracy in which someone who might have purchased something chooses not is harmful.
My assertion is that people who say they would "never" buy something often do when they have to. The guy who claims they would "never" buy WindowBlinds, for instance, very well MIGHT buy WindowBlinds if they could not obtain it via a warez means.
The statistics bear this out. Contrary to what most pirate claims, registrations of software INCREASE as the restrictions on the free version increase. The people who try to say that no nag shareware is a better route for shareware authors are full of crap. While some people do purchase things they have the full version of if they deem it "worth it", statistically, most people only pay money because they have no other choice.
Therefore, statistically, warez DOES hurt because most people who claim they would "never" buy a given thing would in reality do so if they could not get it via a warez method.
Put another way:
Vanilla Ice's point of view is valid in the purist form. But in the real world, warez does hurt.
And stealing is still stealing and is morally wrong. It doesn't matter whether you can prove no one would be hurt or not, it's still wrong.
Similarly, if someone wants to argue that doing drugs is a good thing, that's fine too, just don't tell people where you get yours.
Vanilla Ice's point is valid: If he wouldn't buy the software anyway, how is he hurting anyone? That is the case with any intellectual property.
No reasonable person will claim that piracy in which someone who might have purchased something chooses not is harmful.
My assertion is that people who say they would "never" buy something often do when they have to. The guy who claims they would "never" buy WindowBlinds, for instance, very well MIGHT buy WindowBlinds if they could not obtain it via a warez means.
The statistics bear this out. Contrary to what most pirate claims, registrations of software INCREASE as the restrictions on the free version increase. The people who try to say that no nag shareware is a better route for shareware authors are full of crap. While some people do purchase things they have the full version of if they deem it "worth it", statistically, most people only pay money because they have no other choice.
Therefore, statistically, warez DOES hurt because most people who claim they would "never" buy a given thing would in reality do so if they could not get it via a warez method.
Put another way:
Vanilla Ice's point of view is valid in the purist form. But in the real world, warez does hurt.
And stealing is still stealing and is morally wrong. It doesn't matter whether you can prove no one would be hurt or not, it's still wrong.
Frogboy
Reply #39 Saturday, July 6, 2002 8:27 PM
Reply #39 Saturday, July 6, 2002 8:27 PM
Er:
"No reasonable person will claim that piracy in which someone who might have purchased something chooses not is harmful."
I mean "chooses not to is NOT harmful"
"No reasonable person will claim that piracy in which someone who might have purchased something chooses not is harmful."
I mean "chooses not to is NOT harmful"
Vanilla Ice
Reply #40 Saturday, July 6, 2002 11:41 PM
Reply #40 Saturday, July 6, 2002 11:41 PM
yeah i admit there are some things that i have downloaded that i would buy if i hadn't downloaded them, but that is a very small percent. and most of that stuff is because i don't have the cash to buy them or else i would. for the most part though i wouldn't buy things i download, or if i had bought them i would've wished i hadn't. for example WindowBlinds, if i couldn't get it for download and i had cash i might would buy it (that is if it's about $20, otherwise i don't think it's worth the price), but if i had bnought it i'd've been screwed cause i found out after using it that my computer is too slow to handle it very well and my video card causes several problems with certain skins.
i totaally agree with you that it should be okay to talk about or debate as long as no links are given out, just the same way we could talk about drugs like you said or if we were talking about porn, as long as we didn't post pictures...
i totaally agree with you that it should be okay to talk about or debate as long as no links are given out, just the same way we could talk about drugs like you said or if we were talking about porn, as long as we didn't post pictures...
Please login to comment and/or vote for this skin.
Welcome Guest! Please take the time to register with us.
There are many great features available to you once you register, including:
- Richer content, access to many features that are disabled for guests like commenting on the forums and downloading skins.
- Access to a great community, with a massive database of many, many areas of interest.
- Access to contests & subscription offers like exclusive emails.
- It's simple, and FREE!
|
|
Page 2 of 4 | |
|
|---|
Reply #21 Friday, July 5, 2002 7:58 PM