Apple and its patents
Tuesday, March 4, 2003 by Frogboy | Discussion: WinCustomize News
Ever wondered what kinds of things Apple has patented? Check out this article. Scary.
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StumpMan
Reply #22 Wednesday, March 5, 2003 4:48 PM
Reply #22 Wednesday, March 5, 2003 4:48 PM
I thought Stardock had the spring folders. So does this mean that Apple will be after you guys for having that application?
Frogboy
Reply #23 Wednesday, March 5, 2003 4:49 PM
Reply #23 Wednesday, March 5, 2003 4:49 PM
If your computer is crashing "2 to 3 times per day" you should take it in to be repaired.
I don't remember the last time either Windows XP or MacOS X crashed.
But I do know my Mac is a lot flakier than Windows XP.
Let me give you concrate examples that are easily reproduceable:
1) On Windows XP, I can plug in a memory stick into the USB and it will instantly ask me if I want to play the songs that are on there if it sees MP3s. On the Mac, I have to wait until it shows up as a drive, click on it, find the MP3,s click on them and wait for iTunes to show up.
2) Try connecting to a printer on a LAN that is connected to a Windows machine from a Mac. Talk about a huge pain in the butt.
3) iMovie can't multitask. If you export your movie as a .MOV and switch to another program, the export pauses. So let's say you're saving a 40 gigabyte file, that's going to take hours to do. But you can't let it do it in the background because it'll never get done. Very annoying.
4) iTunes is fairly finicky about what MP3s it'll play. Some of my MP3s play, some abort half way. Other Mac MP3 players work fine on it.
5) Weird errors when copying files over the network or to removable drives. This is a well known issue where the "Work around" is to copy from the command line.
6) iMovie aborts importing movies when it hits a blank spot on the tape meaning you are stuck having to babysit the damn thing the whole way through.
7) If you're not working on a dual CPU Mac, multitasking is NOT smooth at all. If, for instance, you are using iDVD where it is processing your .MOV files in preparation to be burned to DVD, the system gets very sluggish and non responsive, even the dock.
8) The whole system is quite slow. My new iMac 800Mhz is much slower feeling than my ThinkPad 600mhz laptop even when I have the Thinkpad loaded up with every Object Desktop goodie imaginable.
9) There is no way to globally change icons on the Mac. I.e. no IconPackager type utility.
10) The folder views in OS X are pathetic. For example, let's say I have a folder full of pictures. On Windows, I just go to view->thumbnail. On the Mac, I have to mess around with the view options that are several steps and then wait as it glacially converts my pictures to thumbnails all the while the Finder is not responsive. Is it even multithreaded?
11) Did I mention how sluggish the Mac is?
I would love to know how your G4 runs "rings around" your AMD box. Frankly, you sound like a Mac zealot given the claim that your Windows box "crashes 4-5 times per day" nonsense. Here's a clue: MacOS, Linux, Windows 2000/XP don't hardly crash ever. We're all way beyond the Windows 9x and DOS days.
It's not that I don't think the Mac is a decent OS. It is. I could say a lot of nice things about it too. But Apple and its users tend to think they invented everything. I've had Mac users claim WE stole ideas for WindowFX from Apple even though WindowFX was developed long before OS X was released (or in beta). Same for DesktopX.
Frankly, I'm pretty tired of Mac users trying to act like everyone is stealing from Apple. Sure, there are lots of utilties inspired by the Mac. So what? There's tons of Mac software that came from the PC. The MacOS dock is similar to the Windows start bar which in turn was inspired loosely by Steve Job's own NeXT dock. It's gone back and forth for years.
I believe that innovators should protect their work. Apple has every right to patent some of its technologies. But the genie effect? Come on.
Imagine this, if WE were like Apple, we'd be sending cease and desist orders to Konfabulator. Did they borrow ideas from DesktopX? I don't think so. But in the Apple universe, Mac users seem to think that no one can come up with a cool idea independently.
That is what I and others object to.
I don't remember the last time either Windows XP or MacOS X crashed.
But I do know my Mac is a lot flakier than Windows XP.
Let me give you concrate examples that are easily reproduceable:
1) On Windows XP, I can plug in a memory stick into the USB and it will instantly ask me if I want to play the songs that are on there if it sees MP3s. On the Mac, I have to wait until it shows up as a drive, click on it, find the MP3,s click on them and wait for iTunes to show up.
2) Try connecting to a printer on a LAN that is connected to a Windows machine from a Mac. Talk about a huge pain in the butt.
3) iMovie can't multitask. If you export your movie as a .MOV and switch to another program, the export pauses. So let's say you're saving a 40 gigabyte file, that's going to take hours to do. But you can't let it do it in the background because it'll never get done. Very annoying.
4) iTunes is fairly finicky about what MP3s it'll play. Some of my MP3s play, some abort half way. Other Mac MP3 players work fine on it.
5) Weird errors when copying files over the network or to removable drives. This is a well known issue where the "Work around" is to copy from the command line.
6) iMovie aborts importing movies when it hits a blank spot on the tape meaning you are stuck having to babysit the damn thing the whole way through.
7) If you're not working on a dual CPU Mac, multitasking is NOT smooth at all. If, for instance, you are using iDVD where it is processing your .MOV files in preparation to be burned to DVD, the system gets very sluggish and non responsive, even the dock.
8) The whole system is quite slow. My new iMac 800Mhz is much slower feeling than my ThinkPad 600mhz laptop even when I have the Thinkpad loaded up with every Object Desktop goodie imaginable.
9) There is no way to globally change icons on the Mac. I.e. no IconPackager type utility.
10) The folder views in OS X are pathetic. For example, let's say I have a folder full of pictures. On Windows, I just go to view->thumbnail. On the Mac, I have to mess around with the view options that are several steps and then wait as it glacially converts my pictures to thumbnails all the while the Finder is not responsive. Is it even multithreaded?
11) Did I mention how sluggish the Mac is?
I would love to know how your G4 runs "rings around" your AMD box. Frankly, you sound like a Mac zealot given the claim that your Windows box "crashes 4-5 times per day" nonsense. Here's a clue: MacOS, Linux, Windows 2000/XP don't hardly crash ever. We're all way beyond the Windows 9x and DOS days.
It's not that I don't think the Mac is a decent OS. It is. I could say a lot of nice things about it too. But Apple and its users tend to think they invented everything. I've had Mac users claim WE stole ideas for WindowFX from Apple even though WindowFX was developed long before OS X was released (or in beta). Same for DesktopX.
Frankly, I'm pretty tired of Mac users trying to act like everyone is stealing from Apple. Sure, there are lots of utilties inspired by the Mac. So what? There's tons of Mac software that came from the PC. The MacOS dock is similar to the Windows start bar which in turn was inspired loosely by Steve Job's own NeXT dock. It's gone back and forth for years.
I believe that innovators should protect their work. Apple has every right to patent some of its technologies. But the genie effect? Come on.
Imagine this, if WE were like Apple, we'd be sending cease and desist orders to Konfabulator. Did they borrow ideas from DesktopX? I don't think so. But in the Apple universe, Mac users seem to think that no one can come up with a cool idea independently.
That is what I and others object to.
tinkergaloot
Reply #24 Wednesday, March 5, 2003 7:09 PM
Reply #24 Wednesday, March 5, 2003 7:09 PM
You obviously are an idiot of the highest order.
You imply that I'm lying about how often my Windows box crashes, and how my PowerMac is speedier than my Windows box. This I've found to be your typical approach to those with whom you disagree. Sad.
You imply that I'm lying about how often my Windows box crashes, and how my PowerMac is speedier than my Windows box. This I've found to be your typical approach to those with whom you disagree. Sad.
Frogboy
Reply #25 Wednesday, March 5, 2003 11:36 PM
.
So I put forth a host of evidence and you're response is to name-call. Truly sad.
It's people like you that give Mac users a bad name.
Reply #25 Wednesday, March 5, 2003 11:36 PM
.So I put forth a host of evidence and you're response is to name-call. Truly sad.
It's people like you that give Mac users a bad name.
TMO_Bryan
Reply #26 Thursday, March 6, 2003 5:40 AM
Reply #26 Thursday, March 6, 2003 5:40 AM
Just a note that most of the patents referred to in the article are design patents, and not utility patents. For instance, the garbage can patent is a patent on the Mac OS X garbage can *icon*, and not the idea of a garbage can. The two are very, very different.
Others, though, are indeed utility patents. I too am confused on how the cron-oriented patent was obtained, but perhaps I am misunderstanding it.
We posted a follow up article with an explanation of the differences between the two kinds of patents.
Thanks for stopping in.
Bryan
Editor
The Mac Observer
Others, though, are indeed utility patents. I too am confused on how the cron-oriented patent was obtained, but perhaps I am misunderstanding it.
We posted a follow up article with an explanation of the differences between the two kinds of patents.
Thanks for stopping in.
Bryan
Editor
The Mac Observer
TMO_Bryan
Reply #27 Thursday, March 6, 2003 5:44 AM
Reply #27 Thursday, March 6, 2003 5:44 AM
My apologies. I didn't realize the comment engine would edit out the link. For those interested, the article is titled "Understanding Patents & How They Apply To Apple."
FWIW, I am glad I found this site from the referral traffic. I realize most of those reading this likely hate what we cover at The Mac Observer, but I think WinCustomize is interesting. It's always good to keep up with the rest of industry is up to.
Thanks again,
Bryan
Editor
TMO
FWIW, I am glad I found this site from the referral traffic. I realize most of those reading this likely hate what we cover at The Mac Observer, but I think WinCustomize is interesting. It's always good to keep up with the rest of industry is up to.
Thanks again,
Bryan
Editor
TMO
paxx
Reply #28 Thursday, March 6, 2003 9:12 AM
Reply #28 Thursday, March 6, 2003 9:12 AM
The article Bryan refers to is http://www.macobserver.com/editorial/2003/03/05.1.shtml
Frogboy
Reply #29 Thursday, March 6, 2003 11:03 AM
Reply #29 Thursday, March 6, 2003 11:03 AM
I think on a graphics oriented site like this you'll find a Lot of MacOS users (myself included).
This particular topic was really interesting since it really, in my view, outlines my biggest beef with the "Apple culture". That is, that they seem to believe that they are the center of computer innovation.
Object Desktop, for instance, originally came out for OS/2 in 1995. Yet somehow, features that we came up with are regularly claimed by Mac users to have been retroactively taken from the Mac. Whether that be our alpha blended shadows or zoomers or skinning.
As a Mac user myself, I use it for a great number of tasks. It has worked pretty well overall but like Windows, it is no where near perfect and get incensed when I see Mac fanatics come and act like MacOS X is nearly perfect and how terrible "Windoze" is (I'd put MS Movie Maker 2.0 against iMovie any day for instance).
This particular topic was really interesting since it really, in my view, outlines my biggest beef with the "Apple culture". That is, that they seem to believe that they are the center of computer innovation.
Object Desktop, for instance, originally came out for OS/2 in 1995. Yet somehow, features that we came up with are regularly claimed by Mac users to have been retroactively taken from the Mac. Whether that be our alpha blended shadows or zoomers or skinning.
As a Mac user myself, I use it for a great number of tasks. It has worked pretty well overall but like Windows, it is no where near perfect and get incensed when I see Mac fanatics come and act like MacOS X is nearly perfect and how terrible "Windoze" is (I'd put MS Movie Maker 2.0 against iMovie any day for instance).
.
culverSE
Reply #31 Thursday, March 6, 2003 9:24 PM
Reply #31 Thursday, March 6, 2003 9:24 PM
I could not agree more with this article, big businesses are pushing the smaller people around and taking over the WORLD. This news is very similar to the Windows vs. Lindows lawsuit right now. Why does any corporation feel they should have the right to own an idea that is so widely used but so many different people on so many different machines that it has indeed because its own word. Windows may own it own name, but not the right to restrict the word window from any computer organizations' vocabulary. Apple too is playing the smae card and taking hold of ideas that are truely not soley theirs anymore. A trashcan is a trashcan, call it what you will (recycle Bin, etc.) it does the same function and nothing can stop that. And to be honest there is nothing truley orginal with the design of the apple trash bin (it is a metal trash bin, i have on ein my office). Anyway thanks for the article, I found it very amusing and thought provoking. Wincustomize you are now on my top list of sites to check each day, keep up the good stories. 
HG_Eliminator
Reply #32 Friday, March 7, 2003 11:54 PM
Reply #32 Friday, March 7, 2003 11:54 PM
ok for starters i have a liquid cooled 2100xp,1 gig ddr,seagate u320 scsi hdd (3.6ms seek time) gf4 ti4600, with win 2000 pro..... it smokes, the most stable os ive ever run. ive left it running for weeks without a reboot. if ur having probs with ur's its probably user or hardware related. but yes im seeing both mac and M.S. hordeing intelectual property that wasent created by them..frogboy has given an example (window Fx). what i think is funny that the companys can get u all fighting and passionate over their os'es, divide and conquor....each pointing the finger at the other while doing the same..... dun get suckerd in by their sad attemts to draw away form the bigger issue... {patenting someone elses intelectual property is inmoral}....they "borrow" from the lil guys wait a few years then publish it as their new design or concept. if u think this is something new where have u been? thy TMO for being truely journalistic . ur report was insiteful and informative.
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Reply #21 Wednesday, March 5, 2003 4:25 PM