Wallpaper moderation gets tougher
Thursday, September 5, 2002 by Frogboy | Discussion: WinCustomize News
This is always a very tough issue for the moderators of WinCustomize because no one enjoys rejecting the hard work of graphics designers and other artists.
But we want to make sure the site stays focused as a skin site first and doesn't end up flooded with wallpaper. So we're starting to become increasingly pickier on what wallpapers end up on the site.
We generally focus on wallpapers that work as wallpapers (as opposed to just being artistically nice). On top of that, unique-ness helps. Using Bryce to create a landscape is very unlikely to make it up on the site for instance.
I just wanted to write this up so that there are no hard feelings on this.
But we want to make sure the site stays focused as a skin site first and doesn't end up flooded with wallpaper. So we're starting to become increasingly pickier on what wallpapers end up on the site.
We generally focus on wallpapers that work as wallpapers (as opposed to just being artistically nice). On top of that, unique-ness helps. Using Bryce to create a landscape is very unlikely to make it up on the site for instance.
I just wanted to write this up so that there are no hard feelings on this.
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T-Man
Reply #2 Thursday, September 5, 2002 4:29 PM
Reply #2 Thursday, September 5, 2002 4:29 PM
And while we are mentioning it would be great if people would refrain from throwing an XP logo on to their wall as well. I have seen many wallpapers that look great on their own but for some reason the author felt compelled to place an XP logo on it. It usually has no bearing on the original view of the wallpaper what-so-ever other than the author trying to receive download counts.
So it would be appreciated if authors would use some self control and stay away from that XP Logo
So it would be appreciated if authors would use some self control and stay away from that XP Logo
1Renegade
Reply #4 Thursday, September 5, 2002 6:07 PM
Reply #4 Thursday, September 5, 2002 6:07 PM
Maybe it is just me, then again maybe not ........
To "suggest" what artists incorporate into their walls, or what they don't incorporate is a matter to be deceided by the artist, not the moderator. I can understand suggestions or "requests" made on the part of the end-user, but to discount someones creativity based on the "popular consensus" smells of censorship to me. Granted, it seems this site is narrowing its boundries to skins, next we will be hearing that maybe winamp skins are not the "skin-de-jour". Is this the reason why all the wallpapers are so similiar, because they are what the site likes? I enjoy "abstract" art as well as the next guy, but................ I guess if you want your wallpaper to "pass" give 'em what they want.
To "suggest" what artists incorporate into their walls, or what they don't incorporate is a matter to be deceided by the artist, not the moderator. I can understand suggestions or "requests" made on the part of the end-user, but to discount someones creativity based on the "popular consensus" smells of censorship to me. Granted, it seems this site is narrowing its boundries to skins, next we will be hearing that maybe winamp skins are not the "skin-de-jour". Is this the reason why all the wallpapers are so similiar, because they are what the site likes? I enjoy "abstract" art as well as the next guy, but................ I guess if you want your wallpaper to "pass" give 'em what they want.
SuperheroCanadian
Reply #5 Thursday, September 5, 2002 8:55 PM
Reply #5 Thursday, September 5, 2002 8:55 PM
dont mean to rain on the parade but thats the way it works here at wincustomize. It popular concensus, thats y theres sites like deviant art, wallpapers here are meant to compliment the skins on the site not be the main ideaa of the site. if it can go with skins then its good in my opinion
Thats my 2 cents, and may i mid u i am a wallpaper author
Thats my 2 cents, and may i mid u i am a wallpaper author
kith
Reply #6 Thursday, September 5, 2002 9:17 PM
Reply #6 Thursday, September 5, 2002 9:17 PM
I think the first thing that needs to be done is to moderate the current library to the new standard. There are in my opinion, which is pretty worthless 
, many, many, skins that would not come close to making it "in" today.
What I see causing more discontent than anything is not letting in a good wall when there are poor examples still in the library. That will hurt feelings.
Give the membership here an example to aspire to...
, many, many, skins that would not come close to making it "in" today.What I see causing more discontent than anything is not letting in a good wall when there are poor examples still in the library. That will hurt feelings.
Give the membership here an example to aspire to...
Blackxzero
Reply #7 Friday, September 6, 2002 2:20 AM
Reply #7 Friday, September 6, 2002 2:20 AM
From my side of view, it seems like that it would make people feel alot better by not telling it to every, instead email the denied people this message. But on the other hand you should really clean up some of the other sections on this site, there are some pretty plain wallpapers here.
Blackxzero
Reply #8 Friday, September 6, 2002 2:21 AM
Reply #8 Friday, September 6, 2002 2:21 AM
Doh! sorry to double post... I meant "There are some pretty plain skins here too"
Koasati
Reply #9 Friday, September 6, 2002 7:41 AM
Reply #9 Friday, September 6, 2002 7:41 AM
I agree with Bill, clean out the existing library...........and if mine don't make the cut, so be it.
Jafo
Reply #10 Friday, September 6, 2002 10:34 AM
Reply #10 Friday, September 6, 2002 10:34 AM
It's something that I had been thinking of in particular. Back when there were about 800 walls I went through the entire bunch about 3 times over......by the time I had sifted through I'd got 'em down to about 700. [a quite long, time consuming task on a 56k modem] Prior to that there had been no 'conscious' handling of the submissions to any real extent.
That was about a year ago. Since then the site [and its popularity] has grown, hence the larger wall count at present.
The problem seems to me to be how to 'reject' now something that had already 'made it through', except perhaps to compare dl-counts over time.....500 dl's in a week would clearly be better than only managing 500 dl's in a year, ergo the latter was 'less' of a successful wall.
If you filter your browsing through the walls by 'rating' and/or 'dl-count' [popularity], either way you get quite a high standard of works.
At the other end of the scale, save for a few glitches/anomalies, by and large, the walls are significantly less enticing....
But does 2140-odd walls signify 'culling time'?
Is it warranted?
That was about a year ago. Since then the site [and its popularity] has grown, hence the larger wall count at present.
The problem seems to me to be how to 'reject' now something that had already 'made it through', except perhaps to compare dl-counts over time.....500 dl's in a week would clearly be better than only managing 500 dl's in a year, ergo the latter was 'less' of a successful wall.
If you filter your browsing through the walls by 'rating' and/or 'dl-count' [popularity], either way you get quite a high standard of works.
At the other end of the scale, save for a few glitches/anomalies, by and large, the walls are significantly less enticing....
But does 2140-odd walls signify 'culling time'?
Is it warranted?
Jafo
Reply #11 Friday, September 6, 2002 10:36 AM
Reply #11 Friday, September 6, 2002 10:36 AM
We could set the bar at anything less 'popular' than my two walls......that should knock the numbers back to...oh, about 2138...
WOM
Reply #12 Friday, September 6, 2002 10:57 AM
Reply #12 Friday, September 6, 2002 10:57 AM
You could consider culling the herd by date. Say anything over 18 months(just an arbitrary #). That way you would not have to hurt anyones feelings.
Frogboy
Reply #13 Friday, September 6, 2002 12:35 PM
Reply #13 Friday, September 6, 2002 12:35 PM
I've wanted to cull the wallpapers on occasion but it is currently way way too slow. The admin pages are quite slow for us (deleting something is time consuming - like 30 seconds per thing deleted). It's much easier to clamp down more so on newer wallpapers than to cull old ones until we have a system where it's easier to remove several walls at once.
Caylynn
Reply #14 Friday, September 6, 2002 3:12 PM
Reply #14 Friday, September 6, 2002 3:12 PM
I agree with those who have said that you need the cull the current selection of wallpapers. There is some stuff in there that is of poor quality. If people are submitting higher-quality stuff and getting rejected, they might be understandably annoyed if there is poorer-quality stuff still in the wallpaper section.
Perhaps you could get the assistance of a few more individuals to help with the clean-up process?
Perhaps you could get the assistance of a few more individuals to help with the clean-up process?
Koasati
Reply #15 Friday, September 6, 2002 7:51 PM
Reply #15 Friday, September 6, 2002 7:51 PM
Wise...culling by date is a terrible idea.......IMHO
Jafo
Reply #16 Friday, September 6, 2002 8:17 PM
Reply #16 Friday, September 6, 2002 8:17 PM
No....it won't be by date....something may be 'old' but it will be new to a new member of the site.
I think the DL success-rate should be a reasonable criteria.....and that could most likely impact on some works/artists whose work is not normally moderated due to their access level....[yep, I can see mine going, even now]...
I think the DL success-rate should be a reasonable criteria.....and that could most likely impact on some works/artists whose work is not normally moderated due to their access level....[yep, I can see mine going, even now]...
GreenReaper
Reply #17 Friday, September 6, 2002 9:05 PM
Reply #17 Friday, September 6, 2002 9:05 PM
But it's the most popular ones that are causing the most problem by taking up download bandwidth.
Lecrayon
Reply #18 Sunday, September 8, 2002 3:50 PM
Reply #18 Sunday, September 8, 2002 3:50 PM
I hope I will not step on someones toes by reacting here. I agree with what 1renegade says. I also agree some wallpapers shouldnt have gotten through that made it. And I think some should have been in the database while they were rejected. In other words: taste is personal and moderation will always be subjective sifting. The question really is: what policy does WC want to go for. If you want only works that matches some of WB skins, you strike immediately the roots of the artist, namely: freedom.
If you have to design within boundaries it is not fun. One wants to explore, try new things, so you strike originality too, the more if you want the popular works. Innovative work is per definition not rated high (I have read Frogboy saying he sees less innovative wb skins for instance). Well I think that goes for walls too. People always try to imitate what gets the most popular ratings/downloads. There is a big tension between popularity and innovativity. Between concepts using 'existing' rules, and concepts that somehow seem to violate the 'existing' rules. In short: in my opinion it is impossible to eat from two walls (heh), popular/innovative. Well, I wrote this from the heart without rereading, I hope I haven't hurt anyones feelings.
If you have to design within boundaries it is not fun. One wants to explore, try new things, so you strike originality too, the more if you want the popular works. Innovative work is per definition not rated high (I have read Frogboy saying he sees less innovative wb skins for instance). Well I think that goes for walls too. People always try to imitate what gets the most popular ratings/downloads. There is a big tension between popularity and innovativity. Between concepts using 'existing' rules, and concepts that somehow seem to violate the 'existing' rules. In short: in my opinion it is impossible to eat from two walls (heh), popular/innovative. Well, I wrote this from the heart without rereading, I hope I haven't hurt anyones feelings.
Jafo
Reply #19 Monday, September 9, 2002 10:09 AM
Reply #19 Monday, September 9, 2002 10:09 AM
Lecrayon...yes that all makes good sense, but imagine the 'creative freedom' being associated directly with 'wallpapers'. The artist is 'free' to design a 'wallpaper' in the same way that if one were to design a 'car' it is expected that you get a car. If you are requested to design a 'car' and you produce a 'bus' then perhaps it's quite reasonable to expect rejection on the grounds that the product didn't match the 'brief'.
Now the ONLY time this analogy 'falls down' is when the family of 20 looks at the 'bus' and thinks 'car', but generally most will look at a 'bus' and think 'bus'...
As for suggesting to the artist what may or may not suit a wallpaper is akin to suggesting that seats for 45 passengers is a bit OTT for a 'car'...and carrying this analogy to its logical conclusion...suggestions to make a 'bus' more like a 'car' really helps with parking issues when all the parking spaces are 'car'-sized...
For 30 years now, I have been designing residences, etc for clients....they provide criteria/limitations....I fit in [comply]...[as much as possible].
If I want to be 'freely artistic' [with NO limitations] that's on my own time...or for my own use/benefit/projects....where there are no constraints or 'moderation'.
Wincustomize.com has 'limitations/criteria', for good reason....and is a reflection of the 'real-world' of Graphic Design...
Now the ONLY time this analogy 'falls down' is when the family of 20 looks at the 'bus' and thinks 'car', but generally most will look at a 'bus' and think 'bus'...
As for suggesting to the artist what may or may not suit a wallpaper is akin to suggesting that seats for 45 passengers is a bit OTT for a 'car'...and carrying this analogy to its logical conclusion...suggestions to make a 'bus' more like a 'car' really helps with parking issues when all the parking spaces are 'car'-sized...
For 30 years now, I have been designing residences, etc for clients....they provide criteria/limitations....I fit in [comply]...[as much as possible].
If I want to be 'freely artistic' [with NO limitations] that's on my own time...or for my own use/benefit/projects....where there are no constraints or 'moderation'.
Wincustomize.com has 'limitations/criteria', for good reason....and is a reflection of the 'real-world' of Graphic Design...
Lecrayon
Reply #20 Monday, September 9, 2002 1:16 PM
Reply #20 Monday, September 9, 2002 1:16 PM
Look Jafo, I am not willing to go over it all again. It's obvious we look at the same topic from different professions. You are fully entitled to give your view about it. What I do is PAINT the car, bus, surfboard, canvas. In that I am free to choose whatever medium I like, no boundaries, the only boundaries I have is the size of the object. I am NOT attacking Wincustomize, NOT attacking limitations/criteria. I merely say something from MY world. And please stop everytime to say I 'suggest' things. PLEASE.
In wallpapers you are NOT free, you have to take in mind colours that are soothing for the eye for instance. "If I want to be 'freely artistic' [with NO limitations] that's on my own time...or for my own use/benefit/projects" > I have the luck being in that position! Can you stop now? And just accept there are different views?
In wallpapers you are NOT free, you have to take in mind colours that are soothing for the eye for instance. "If I want to be 'freely artistic' [with NO limitations] that's on my own time...or for my own use/benefit/projects" > I have the luck being in that position! Can you stop now? And just accept there are different views?
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Reply #1 Thursday, September 5, 2002 2:27 PM