Still having MAJOR skin update/delete issues.
Ancient problem...still a huge hassle.
Thursday, July 12, 2007 by I.R. Brainiac | Discussion: WindowBlinds
This has been brought up many times and nothing ever done about it. 
vStyler and I send skin updates regularly to each other and other testers...we even delete our own skins if there is a need to and reinstall backup versions.
We send updates to customers.We ALWAYS tell them...dont forget to uninstall old version before installing new.(many will neglect to do this,we sometimes forget and we are right in the damn middle of discussing it
)
But a simple 'delete this skin' from wbconfig isnt enough...more often than not,it leaves the folder either empty,or with 1 or 2 fonts in it.(sometimes not being used by the current skin so it aint that)
Attempting to install the skin,WB renames it and no skin shows in the skin list.Sometimes it hangs so bad while attempting to install,you have to reboot...to a blank skin...if your lucky.
So you go into WB folder and attempt a manual deletion...werks sometimes,others REFUSE to delete...so now you cant get the update to install at all without a reboot.(one folder was completely empty...and would NOT delete)
We have come to the conclusion that we should NEVER update a skin because half of the people will see no difference or it will even hang their pc.
Unfortunately,skinners dont have the option to NOT update while creating...its part of the process.
vStyler and I send skin updates regularly to each other and other testers...we even delete our own skins if there is a need to and reinstall backup versions.
We send updates to customers.We ALWAYS tell them...dont forget to uninstall old version before installing new.(many will neglect to do this,we sometimes forget and we are right in the damn middle of discussing it
)But a simple 'delete this skin' from wbconfig isnt enough...more often than not,it leaves the folder either empty,or with 1 or 2 fonts in it.(sometimes not being used by the current skin so it aint that)
Attempting to install the skin,WB renames it and no skin shows in the skin list.Sometimes it hangs so bad while attempting to install,you have to reboot...to a blank skin...if your lucky.
So you go into WB folder and attempt a manual deletion...werks sometimes,others REFUSE to delete...so now you cant get the update to install at all without a reboot.(one folder was completely empty...and would NOT delete)
We have come to the conclusion that we should NEVER update a skin because half of the people will see no difference or it will even hang their pc.
Unfortunately,skinners dont have the option to NOT update while creating...its part of the process.
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eieio
Reply #22 Thursday, July 12, 2007 10:57 PM
Reply #22 Thursday, July 12, 2007 10:57 PM
astute ... hmm ... astute .. yes! .. I'm astute!
had to think about that one for a minute.
had to think about that one for a minute.
I.R. Brainiac
Reply #24 Thursday, July 12, 2007 11:24 PM
Reply #24 Thursday, July 12, 2007 11:24 PM
might at least speedup the process for skinning purposes. 
Dosnt help with end user issues tho.
Thanks bobdown
Dosnt help with end user issues tho.
Thanks bobdown
Mark
Reply #25 Thursday, July 12, 2007 11:27 PM
Reply #25 Thursday, July 12, 2007 11:27 PM
It should make those nasty fonts deletable without re-booting anyway. Hopefully 
I.R. Brainiac
Reply #26 Thursday, July 12, 2007 11:42 PM
Reply #26 Thursday, July 12, 2007 11:42 PM
And of course I go to test it and cant get one to NOT delete... tho when it does it ,it does it a lot.......
tho when it does it ,it does it a lot.......
aufisch
Reply #27 Friday, July 13, 2007 12:53 AM
Reply #27 Friday, July 13, 2007 12:53 AM
I know that it won't solve the cause of your problems, but until it is fixed: Have you thought of using a proggie like "unlocker" (it's freeware)?
I have been running this on my XP-machine successfully for a while now. It even tells you exactly which program holds on to an "undeletable" file.
I have been running this on my XP-machine successfully for a while now. It even tells you exactly which program holds on to an "undeletable" file.
mitche323
Reply #28 Monday, July 16, 2007 6:39 PM
Reply #28 Monday, July 16, 2007 6:39 PM
Hello IR Brainiac and vStyler - got the answer for all of you - get KnotVista, never will need to change a skin font again.
Seriously, what is needed is for more of a meeting of the minds between those educated in skinning and those educated in computers. I started using unlocker the first time a font stuck on me, because I knew about unlocker.
I liked "SystemForceJapan" icons so much, I made them my default icons, by using a program to place each icon into shell32.dll. Now I can change icons all day long with iconpackager and then revert to default which is SystemForce.
I don't expect a skin program such as windowblinds to add things to shell32.dll - but unlocking a file is very elementary as far as computers go and stardock should be able to very easily add the code to its program.
I think that windowblinds probably has something going on as far as copyright issues and does not add the fonts directly to the fonts folder in c:\windows - so the computer is using the file that is in the windowblinds folder - and can not let it go.
I just physically copy and paste the ttf files into the fonts folder and it has worked for me. No problems in a long time. But I also have "Windows File Protection" turned off and maybe that helps.
mitch
ps; please vStyler, dont give up on updates - I love your work and I know how to apply skins to my computer. I assume others do also - just keep dragging the rest of the world along until they finally catch up.
ps2; In TweakUI the last item listed is "repair" - the second item on the scroll bar is "repair font folder" takes about 1/4 second, no reboot required. So you are in another skin and want to delete a differant skin that you suspect or know has unusual fonts, hit repair font folder first in tweakui, (this will clear the font from memory) - then delete the file through windowblinds.
gotta go
Seriously, what is needed is for more of a meeting of the minds between those educated in skinning and those educated in computers. I started using unlocker the first time a font stuck on me, because I knew about unlocker.
I liked "SystemForceJapan" icons so much, I made them my default icons, by using a program to place each icon into shell32.dll. Now I can change icons all day long with iconpackager and then revert to default which is SystemForce.
I don't expect a skin program such as windowblinds to add things to shell32.dll - but unlocking a file is very elementary as far as computers go and stardock should be able to very easily add the code to its program.
I think that windowblinds probably has something going on as far as copyright issues and does not add the fonts directly to the fonts folder in c:\windows - so the computer is using the file that is in the windowblinds folder - and can not let it go.
I just physically copy and paste the ttf files into the fonts folder and it has worked for me. No problems in a long time. But I also have "Windows File Protection" turned off and maybe that helps.
mitch
ps; please vStyler, dont give up on updates - I love your work and I know how to apply skins to my computer. I assume others do also - just keep dragging the rest of the world along until they finally catch up.
ps2; In TweakUI the last item listed is "repair" - the second item on the scroll bar is "repair font folder" takes about 1/4 second, no reboot required. So you are in another skin and want to delete a differant skin that you suspect or know has unusual fonts, hit repair font folder first in tweakui, (this will clear the font from memory) - then delete the file through windowblinds.
gotta go
mitche323
Reply #29 Monday, July 16, 2007 8:54 PM
Reply #29 Monday, July 16, 2007 8:54 PM
One other note that you might like, if you are having fonts stuck literally for months - you probably have other things stuck also that you are not aware of. Once every month or two, go into Control panel- system - advanced - performace settings, advanced - virtual memory. Check "no paging file" and then hit "SET" - reboot and do a defrag - then set the memory back to whatever it was under custom size, no reboot needed this time.
Of course I assume that if it's "Knot Vista" , you've got XP2 lololol
you'll be good to go
Of course I assume that if it's "Knot Vista" , you've got XP2 lololol
you'll be good to go
I.R. Brainiac
Reply #30 Monday, July 16, 2007 9:54 PM
Reply #30 Monday, July 16, 2007 9:54 PM
all good suggestions...but as pictoratus pointed out...other progs delete fonts that were previously in use no problem.
the issue isnt even just about the skinner...the end user cant be expected to jump thru all these hoops for a simple skin update.
the issue isnt even just about the skinner...the end user cant be expected to jump thru all these hoops for a simple skin update.
mitche323
Reply #31 Monday, July 16, 2007 9:59 PM
Reply #31 Monday, July 16, 2007 9:59 PM
I agree!
but unlocking a file is very elementary as far as computers go and stardock should be able to very easily add the code to its program.
look, the guy that invented "Unlocker" gives it away for free for geez sakes and.........he has been giving it away for about ten years now!!!!!!!!!!
when I first got windowblinds, it just about ruined my computer over this very issue, I was ready to sue everybody lol - the black screens on reboot, the deformed skins - i've been through it all. But I understood that it was cutting edge and i wanted the skins, so i taught myself.
Mitch
but unlocking a file is very elementary as far as computers go and stardock should be able to very easily add the code to its program.
look, the guy that invented "Unlocker" gives it away for free for geez sakes and.........he has been giving it away for about ten years now!!!!!!!!!!
when I first got windowblinds, it just about ruined my computer over this very issue, I was ready to sue everybody lol - the black screens on reboot, the deformed skins - i've been through it all. But I understood that it was cutting edge and i wanted the skins, so i taught myself.
Mitch
mitche323
Reply #32 Monday, July 16, 2007 11:15 PM
Reply #32 Monday, July 16, 2007 11:15 PM
I'll give Stardock something constructive to work on. As it stands right now the name of the skin folder and the uis file contained within have to match exactly for the skin to work. So the "vienna" folder has vienna.uis inside.
Why?
Why cant the name of the skin match the folder and windowblinds searches for "any" uis file inside?
So now an update could simply be renamed Vienna2 and reside in a folder named Vienna2 but the artist would not have to manualy rename every bmp and tga and componant therein.
mitch
Why?
Why cant the name of the skin match the folder and windowblinds searches for "any" uis file inside?
So now an update could simply be renamed Vienna2 and reside in a folder named Vienna2 but the artist would not have to manualy rename every bmp and tga and componant therein.
mitch
vStyler
Reply #33 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 1:17 AM
Reply #33 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 1:17 AM
WB lets you rename a skin rather easily actually and I have thought of going that route.. However it does cause a few problems you have to go back and fix.
Personally Im just hoping Stardock can fix the access denied fonts problem and be done with it.
Personally Im just hoping Stardock can fix the access denied fonts problem and be done with it.
[email protected]
Reply #34 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 1:58 PM
Reply #34 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 1:58 PM
WB6 handles skin updates differently to WB5.
I.R. Brainiac
Reply #35 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 3:40 PM 
Let us pray...oh Lord,let differently mean better.
Hi Nakor.
Reply #35 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 3:40 PM
Let us pray...oh Lord,let differently mean better. Hi Nakor.
NightTrainthedark
Reply #36 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 3:49 PM
I like the cockiness I am feeling from Stardock about the next jump with Wb and Skinstudio. I am very excited.
I think I'm in Love with I.R.
Reply #36 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 3:49 PM
WB6 handles skin updates differently to WB5.
I like the cockiness I am feeling from Stardock about the next jump with Wb and Skinstudio. I am very excited.
I think I'm in Love with I.R.
vStyler
Reply #37 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 3:52 PM
Meaning we won't have this problem anymore?
Reply #37 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 3:52 PM
WB6 handles skin updates differently to WB5.
Meaning we won't have this problem anymore?
I think I'm in Love with I.R.
mitche323
Reply #38 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 3:59 PM
Reply #38 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 3:59 PM
(all good suggestions...but as pictoratus pointed out...other progs delete fonts that were previously in use no problem.
the issue isnt even just about the skinner...the end user cant be expected to jump thru all these hoops for a simple skin update.)
Well, in the first post two differant problems were raised. One is providing a finished product for the end-user - this is clearly windowblinds responsibility.
The other was more of a on-the-fly type back and forth thing between skinners dealing with works in progress. The hints I gave were for that.
Is wb6 only for vista - cause vista will never ever be on this computer - I'll go back to the pony express b4 installing vista.
the issue isnt even just about the skinner...the end user cant be expected to jump thru all these hoops for a simple skin update.)
Well, in the first post two differant problems were raised. One is providing a finished product for the end-user - this is clearly windowblinds responsibility.
The other was more of a on-the-fly type back and forth thing between skinners dealing with works in progress. The hints I gave were for that.
Is wb6 only for vista - cause vista will never ever be on this computer - I'll go back to the pony express b4 installing vista.
Daiwa
Reply #39 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 4:26 PM
Reply #39 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 4:26 PM
WB6 will work just fine on XP and actually adds some previously unavailable features for that OS. Doubt 2K will be supported, unfortunately. Aside from that, qualified riders could be hard to find these days.
I.R. Brainiac
Reply #40 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 6:20 PM
And they will get tried...thanks man.
Reply #40 Tuesday, July 17, 2007 6:20 PM
The other was more of a on-the-fly type back and forth thing between skinners dealing with works in progress. The hints I gave were for that.
And they will get tried...thanks man.
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Reply #21 Thursday, July 12, 2007 10:53 PM
How astute of you Stephen...somebody gets it.