![Cobalt Zin[cave]](https://skins15.wincustomize.com/0/1/1354/20/5/preview-20-5-100x75.jpg?d=991713824.453)
Linux 101
Thursday, April 22, 2004 by uM0p apsdn | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
Believe it or not, I''m getting little help from the linux forums. In trying to learn Linux, I''ve downloaded SLAX distro. Questions:
1. How do I install .tar.gz files? And run them, if not by "double-clicking"?
2. Where can I find the useful commands? (I''ve googled and found little discription as to how to use the listed commands)
3. Which distribution is the "best" for everyday use?
4. Which one of use use Linux? Raise your hand.
1. How do I install .tar.gz files? And run them, if not by "double-clicking"?
2. Where can I find the useful commands? (I''ve googled and found little discription as to how to use the listed commands)
3. Which distribution is the "best" for everyday use?
4. Which one of use use Linux? Raise your hand.
 |
|
Page 1 of 2 | |
|
|---|
Orion
Reply #2 Thursday, April 22, 2004 10:45 PM
Reply #2 Thursday, April 22, 2004 10:45 PM
I`m afraid you`re not going to get very far in Linux by clicking on files. You`ve got to get down with a terminal window.
1) You need to un-gzip then un-tar the file.
gzip -d somefile.tar.gz
then...
tar xvf somefile.tar
That will leave you (more than likely) with a subdirectory under your current directory. You then go into that directory and (gasp) read the README or INSTALL text file. Usually installing a tarball (that`s what you have) is:
./configure (configures the makefiles for your system)
make (compiles "makes" the binaries)
make install (installs the binaries, man pages, config files)
2) Unix/Linux for dummies...no offence intended. Also look for Unix/Linux command line cheat sheets.
3) I like Mandrake and RedHat Fedora
4) I use RedHat more in a production environment than any other distro.
Happy typing...
...and good luck.
[Message Edited]
1) You need to un-gzip then un-tar the file.
gzip -d somefile.tar.gz
then...
tar xvf somefile.tar
That will leave you (more than likely) with a subdirectory under your current directory. You then go into that directory and (gasp) read the README or INSTALL text file. Usually installing a tarball (that`s what you have) is:
./configure (configures the makefiles for your system)
make (compiles "makes" the binaries)
make install (installs the binaries, man pages, config files)
2) Unix/Linux for dummies...no offence intended. Also look for Unix/Linux command line cheat sheets.
3) I like Mandrake and RedHat Fedora
4) I use RedHat more in a production environment than any other distro.
Happy typing...
...and good luck.[Message Edited]
uM0p apsdn
Reply #3 Friday, April 23, 2004 11:25 AM
Reply #3 Friday, April 23, 2004 11:25 AM
Kona, could you re-email me again? I''ve been getting alot of spam in this address lately, and I might have deleted your email(s). Some had their emails bounced. 
I''ll email you to save your address so I won''t accidentally delete it.
Since I don''t know the commands, I''m pretty much down to the clicking.
I''ve found list and list of commands, but their discriptions as to how to use them well...
What''s the difference between Mandrake and RedHat or the distro? Yes, I''ve heard Mandrake is the easiest to learn, but it sounds limiting to me.
I''ll email you to save your address so I won''t accidentally delete it.Since I don''t know the commands, I''m pretty much down to the clicking.
I''ve found list and list of commands, but their discriptions as to how to use them well...What''s the difference between Mandrake and RedHat or the distro? Yes, I''ve heard Mandrake is the easiest to learn, but it sounds limiting to me.
craeonics
Reply #4 Friday, April 23, 2004 1:52 PM
Reply #4 Friday, April 23, 2004 1:52 PM
If on one hand you don''t know much about it and on the other think it might be "limiting" (a & b = illogical), why not give ManDrake a shot first to get some experience.
Don''t think it matters much what you run. They all have installers these days.
Don''t think it matters much what you run. They all have installers these days.
juni
Reply #5 Friday, April 23, 2004 1:54 PM
Reply #5 Friday, April 23, 2004 1:54 PM
I sadly removed my debian partitions today, it was just too much of a hassle to keep up with the unstable version (yes, the stable one is just what it says, but if you want the latest...). What did it for me was one upgrade where X wouldn''t start - demanding a kernel-recompile to get the latest nvidia drivers to work. Too time consuming. But I must say: I am very impressed with Gnome - it is getting better every day.
uM0p apsdn
Reply #6 Friday, April 23, 2004 4:29 PM
Reply #6 Friday, April 23, 2004 4:29 PM
It''s not about wanting the lastest. I want to learn the basics first, but have a distro that will provide the options to do more w/o installing a different OS.
And because I don''t know, I''ll think as I assummed. Of course I could be wrong because I don''t know what I''m thinking is right, right?
And because I don''t know, I''ll think as I assummed. Of course I could be wrong because I don''t know what I''m thinking is right, right?
Orion
Reply #8 Friday, April 23, 2004 11:52 PM
That''s not how it works. You can pretty much add whatever you want to any distro. Just download the tarball for the feature or server you want and install it as stated in the README (or in #2 above). It can get real hairy though. Just wait until you start chasing down dependencies...which is when what you`re trying to install requires another library and that library requires some other package and so on, and so on. I''ve been doing Unix for almost twenty years and it''s still the most annoying aspect this OS.
Just download the RedHat or Mandrake ISO(s) and go for it. Tips:
1) Command line....use it. You can`t do much (administratively) with the GUI
2) Learn VI (non-GUI text editor). If your system won`t boot into X (the GUI) how would you find and fix the problem?
3) When installing (adding) packages after initial install of the OS, try to stick with RPMs. It''s the closest thing to a SETUP.EXE you see in Linux (for the most part).
4) Stick to it...it can be very intimidating at times even for very experienced users.
Reply #8 Friday, April 23, 2004 11:52 PM
| #6 by uM0p ap!sdn - 4/23/2004 4:29:25 PM It''''s not about wanting the lastest. I want to learn the basics first, but have a distro that will provide the options to do more w/o installing a different OS. |
That''s not how it works. You can pretty much add whatever you want to any distro. Just download the tarball for the feature or server you want and install it as stated in the README (or in #2 above). It can get real hairy though. Just wait until you start chasing down dependencies...which is when what you`re trying to install requires another library and that library requires some other package and so on, and so on. I''ve been doing Unix for almost twenty years and it''s still the most annoying aspect this OS.
Just download the RedHat or Mandrake ISO(s) and go for it. Tips:
1) Command line....use it. You can`t do much (administratively) with the GUI
2) Learn VI (non-GUI text editor). If your system won`t boot into X (the GUI) how would you find and fix the problem?
3) When installing (adding) packages after initial install of the OS, try to stick with RPMs. It''s the closest thing to a SETUP.EXE you see in Linux (for the most part).
4) Stick to it...it can be very intimidating at times even for very experienced users.
uM0p apsdn
Reply #9 Saturday, April 24, 2004 1:00 AM
Reply #9 Saturday, April 24, 2004 1:00 AM
I''ve alot more to learn than I thought.
I''m sure I can figure out how to do these things, once I know/learn/find the commands. I know there''s much more to it than the commands, but for starters, I "think" learning the lingos and the basic commands is the way to go.
And I agree.... just download and go for it. I''ll get a copy of Fedora soon. 56k is not a good thing for downloading.
I''m sure I can figure out how to do these things, once I know/learn/find the commands. I know there''s much more to it than the commands, but for starters, I "think" learning the lingos and the basic commands is the way to go.
And I agree.... just download and go for it. I''ll get a copy of Fedora soon. 56k is not a good thing for downloading.
Jafo
Reply #10 Saturday, April 24, 2004 2:19 AM
Reply #10 Saturday, April 24, 2004 2:19 AM
Linux used to be the realm of the propeller-head...and to a certain degree still is....it''s not something for the faint-hearted....and it''s all about the journey, not the destination....
juni
Reply #11 Saturday, April 24, 2004 4:06 AM
Reply #11 Saturday, April 24, 2004 4:06 AM
Hehe 
Wait until you go for the unstable version (so you can have support for your new gadgets) and don''t update in a while and then do a complete package update.
But I have to say, installing things is a snap with the debian packaging system.
Wait until you go for the unstable version (so you can have support for your new gadgets) and don''t update in a while and then do a complete package update.
But I have to say, installing things is a snap with the debian packaging system.
Orion
Reply #12 Saturday, April 24, 2004 12:00 PM
True...and very profound. They should adopt that as the Linux tag-line.
1) IMO end users should NEVER use the unstable version...there`s just no justification. The only case I can think of to try the unstable version is if someone is a developer that needs to test their software in prep for the new version or they`re a tester for the distro.
2) Yes, debs are great, but the many packages are not available in deb (or RPM for that matter). IMO, one should still be very familiar with installing tarballs if they want to get anywhere.
Reply #12 Saturday, April 24, 2004 12:00 PM
| #10 by Admin Jafo - 4/24/2004 2:19:33 AM ...and it`s all about the journey, not the destination.... |
True...and very profound. They should adopt that as the Linux tag-line.
| #11 by juni - 4/24/2004 4:06:14 AM Wait until you go for the unstable version (so you can have support for your new gadgets) and don''''t update in a while and then do a complete package update. But I have to say, installing things is a snap with the debian packaging system. |
1) IMO end users should NEVER use the unstable version...there`s just no justification. The only case I can think of to try the unstable version is if someone is a developer that needs to test their software in prep for the new version or they`re a tester for the distro.
2) Yes, debs are great, but the many packages are not available in deb (or RPM for that matter). IMO, one should still be very familiar with installing tarballs if they want to get anywhere.
uM0p apsdn
Reply #13 Saturday, April 24, 2004 12:58 PM
Reply #13 Saturday, April 24, 2004 12:58 PM
Again I ask, which distro for a newbie and why? "It''s the easiest for a beginner..." doesn''t say much for me.
Or should I ask, what''s the difference between them all?? And why choose one over the other? Doesn''t matter if it''s for a newbie or not, which and why???
Or should I ask, what''s the difference between them all?? And why choose one over the other? Doesn''t matter if it''s for a newbie or not, which and why???
Orion
Reply #14 Saturday, April 24, 2004 2:11 PM
I`m partial to RedHat. I like the GUI installation. The other reason is I`m simply more used to RH and it`s structure and behavior than the other distros I`ve used.
That is really an impossible question to answer. Some are BSD-based (FreeBSD) and others are System V-based (RedHat). Don`t ask what`s the difference, because you might as well be asking and easier question like "What`s the meaning of life?". You might also want to consider a "live" distro like Knoppix. No install needed, you just boot up off the CD and you''ve got a Linux system. It will not modify or take over your system, so you can play with it without doing partitioning or dual-booting.
Just pick one, and try it.
Reply #14 Saturday, April 24, 2004 2:11 PM
| #13 by uM0p ap!sdn - 4/24/2004 12:58:52 PM Again I ask, which distro for a newbie and why? "It`s the easiest for a beginner..." doesn`t say much for me. |
I`m partial to RedHat. I like the GUI installation. The other reason is I`m simply more used to RH and it`s structure and behavior than the other distros I`ve used.
| Or should I ask, what`s the difference between them all?? And why choose one over the other? Doesn`t matter if it`s for a newbie or not, which and why??? |
That is really an impossible question to answer. Some are BSD-based (FreeBSD) and others are System V-based (RedHat). Don`t ask what`s the difference, because you might as well be asking and easier question like "What`s the meaning of life?". You might also want to consider a "live" distro like Knoppix. No install needed, you just boot up off the CD and you''ve got a Linux system. It will not modify or take over your system, so you can play with it without doing partitioning or dual-booting.
Just pick one, and try it.
Rocky Nimda
Reply #16 Saturday, April 24, 2004 7:56 PM
These two steps can be done in one step by using gnu tar, which is the standard tar command on LINUX systems. Try the following:
tar zxvf somfile.tar.gz
This saves a step, plus saves on diskspace by not creating the uncompressed tarball.
This is one of the most important tips that anyone can give you. VI isn''t user friendly, I like to call it expert friendly, but VI is your friend. Learn it well.
It is on EVERY UNIX/LINUX system that there is. It is one of the most powerful text editors that exists.
Note: a text editor is not a Word Processor.
If you want to learn some power-user stuff, learn awk & sed. You can use these tools in combination with other things to do about anything in UNIX. They are also very powerful.
Another tip, don''t log in as "root". Create a normal user account and log in as that user. Only use root when it is needed. You can easily become root by using "su -", but only stay logged in as root for as long as needed, then exit back to your normal account.
As soon as you can figure out how, disable all non secure telnet like programs and replace them with the equivalent secured versions like ssh. This way you don''t transmit passwords in clear text. The SecureShell commands encrypt everything, so no one will be able to see your passwords and other stuff in clear text.
Like I said about VI, LINUX isn''t user friendly, it''s expert friendly. You need to learn a lot about it to feel comfortable with it, and you need to learn a lot to be able to make it secure. But, once you have taken the time to learn it, it is very stable and very secure. My LINUX box has been up and running for over a year. How long has it been since you have had to reboot your PC? I normally end up rebooting my PC at least once or twice a week.
Reply #16 Saturday, April 24, 2004 7:56 PM
| 1) You need to un-gzip then un-tar the file.gzip -d somefile.tar.gzthen...tar xvf somefile.tar |
These two steps can be done in one step by using gnu tar, which is the standard tar command on LINUX systems. Try the following:
tar zxvf somfile.tar.gz
This saves a step, plus saves on diskspace by not creating the uncompressed tarball.
| 2) Learn VI (non-GUI text editor). If your system won’t boot into X (the GUI) how would you find and fix the problem? |
This is one of the most important tips that anyone can give you. VI isn''t user friendly, I like to call it expert friendly, but VI is your friend. Learn it well.
It is on EVERY UNIX/LINUX system that there is. It is one of the most powerful text editors that exists.
Note: a text editor is not a Word Processor.
If you want to learn some power-user stuff, learn awk & sed. You can use these tools in combination with other things to do about anything in UNIX. They are also very powerful.
Another tip, don''t log in as "root". Create a normal user account and log in as that user. Only use root when it is needed. You can easily become root by using "su -", but only stay logged in as root for as long as needed, then exit back to your normal account.
As soon as you can figure out how, disable all non secure telnet like programs and replace them with the equivalent secured versions like ssh. This way you don''t transmit passwords in clear text. The SecureShell commands encrypt everything, so no one will be able to see your passwords and other stuff in clear text.
Like I said about VI, LINUX isn''t user friendly, it''s expert friendly. You need to learn a lot about it to feel comfortable with it, and you need to learn a lot to be able to make it secure. But, once you have taken the time to learn it, it is very stable and very secure. My LINUX box has been up and running for over a year. How long has it been since you have had to reboot your PC? I normally end up rebooting my PC at least once or twice a week.
uM0p apsdn
Reply #17 Sunday, April 25, 2004 1:30 AM
Reply #17 Sunday, April 25, 2004 1:30 AM
Where can I find tutorials on VI? And how do I get into VI?
For the time being, I want to learn the basic commands first so I can get my way around Linux w/o the gui. Right?
So how do I create a new use account? I've only been in the root account.
The last time I reboot XP was last night. I don't leave it on when I'm not using it.
For the time being, I want to learn the basic commands first so I can get my way around Linux w/o the gui. Right?
So how do I create a new use account? I've only been in the root account.
The last time I reboot XP was last night. I don't leave it on when I'm not using it.
Orion
Reply #18 Sunday, April 25, 2004 9:45 AM
The intarweb is a good place to start. There''s this new thing...it`s really cool...it`s called a search engine. It lets you search for things. Like "Linux VI tutorial"
See above.
Can`t hurt. Learn the structure of the file system too. It`s very important to know where things are like config files, startup scripts, binaries, user home directories, etc. are. Also, learn to use the man pages. "Man", in this case, is short for "manual"...as in documentation. Usage: man commandname Example: man vi
You could always try something like a google search on "creating a user account in linux"
A piece of friendly advice: No offence, but I can see why you`re not getting much help from linux forums. In general, they don`t like to spoon-feed people. You should at least take some initiative to find your answer before posting. Almost every question here could have been answered by a simple google search.
Good luck and happy *nixing.
Reply #18 Sunday, April 25, 2004 9:45 AM
| Where can I find tutorials on VI? |
The intarweb is a good place to start. There''s this new thing...it`s really cool...it`s called a search engine. It lets you search for things. Like "Linux VI tutorial"
| And how do I get into VI? |
See above.
| For the time being, I want to learn the basic commands first so I can get my way around Linux w/o the gui. Right? |
Can`t hurt. Learn the structure of the file system too. It`s very important to know where things are like config files, startup scripts, binaries, user home directories, etc. are. Also, learn to use the man pages. "Man", in this case, is short for "manual"...as in documentation. Usage: man commandname Example: man vi
| So how do I create a new use account? I`ve only been in the root account. |
You could always try something like a google search on "creating a user account in linux"
A piece of friendly advice: No offence, but I can see why you`re not getting much help from linux forums. In general, they don`t like to spoon-feed people. You should at least take some initiative to find your answer before posting. Almost every question here could have been answered by a simple google search.
Good luck and happy *nixing.
uM0p apsdn
Reply #19 Sunday, April 25, 2004 3:03 PM
Reply #19 Sunday, April 25, 2004 3:03 PM
Acturally, I am searching google. But that's after I've posted the posts. However, most of the item, what I've found included descriptions that only those who are fimilar with Linux can understand. Their descrtipions as to "how-to" are not as descriptive. Maybe it's me, I can try turning my monitor rightside up and see if it helps.
Orion
Reply #20 Sunday, April 25, 2004 10:00 PM
Reply #20 Sunday, April 25, 2004 10:00 PM
Don`t give up. A decent book would go a long way. If you have no command-line, file system, or networking experience I`m not sure where to point you. I take a lot for granted after being a propeller-head (as Jafo calls us ) for more than 25 years and a systems/network admin for 17 of those. I once had a C for Windows book (for Dummies) and it actually helped put things in a way that I could relate to when I had no idea or experience to draw from. I already had done a ton of C and Motif programming, but windows programming was so alien to me that I was totally lost.
Just keep poking at it. If you`re stuborn, you`ll most certainly win! NEVER let the computer win.
) for more than 25 years and a systems/network admin for 17 of those. I once had a C for Windows book (for Dummies) and it actually helped put things in a way that I could relate to when I had no idea or experience to draw from. I already had done a ton of C and Motif programming, but windows programming was so alien to me that I was totally lost.Just keep poking at it. If you`re stuborn, you`ll most certainly win! NEVER let the computer win.
Please login to comment and/or vote for this skin.
Welcome Guest! Please take the time to register with us.
There are many great features available to you once you register, including:
- Richer content, access to many features that are disabled for guests like commenting on the forums and downloading skins.
- Access to a great community, with a massive database of many, many areas of interest.
- Access to contests & subscription offers like exclusive emails.
- It's simple, and FREE!
|
|
Page 1 of 2 | |
|
|---|
Reply #1 Thursday, April 22, 2004 10:05 PM