How many is too many?
Tuesday, May 6, 2003 by grayhaze | Discussion: WinCustomize Talk
If you could have a button on your window titlebars to do anything, what would it do? That's a serious question aimed at productivity enhancement by the way, so please don't repeat your 'X-Men power' here. 
What standard applications would you like to be able to launch with a single click?
What function of Windows would you like an easy shortcut to?
I want a nice long list here, so I can give you a skin with more buttons than you'd ever consider possible.
What standard applications would you like to be able to launch with a single click?
What function of Windows would you like an easy shortcut to?
I want a nice long list here, so I can give you a skin with more buttons than you'd ever consider possible.
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grayhaze
Reply #22 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 4:31 AM
Reply #22 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 4:31 AM
Maybe I'm just not as good as I used to be Sylva, but I can't get anything other than a '.exe' file to run with the 'Execute command' buttons. If I could just execute the '.scf' file, it would make things so much simpler.
I seem to remember at some point there was talk of how to get an associated application to run just by entering the file extension too. So for instance, to run the configured text editor and not just Notepad, you would put '.txt' or something for the command. I could be wrong, but can anyone else shed any light on this.
While your method would work for 2K and XP, LS_Boreas, I'm trying to find generic actions that will work for all flavours of Windows. I've done this with a few of the more useful ones already, but it's just this damn 'Show Desktop' that's proving harder than it should be.
What would be nice is the ability to execute keyboard shortcuts on the press of a button. There are quite a few very useful shortcuts which are common to all versions of Windows, and it would be nice to have simple one-click access to these.
I seem to remember at some point there was talk of how to get an associated application to run just by entering the file extension too. So for instance, to run the configured text editor and not just Notepad, you would put '.txt' or something for the command. I could be wrong, but can anyone else shed any light on this.
While your method would work for 2K and XP, LS_Boreas, I'm trying to find generic actions that will work for all flavours of Windows. I've done this with a few of the more useful ones already, but it's just this damn 'Show Desktop' that's proving harder than it should be.
What would be nice is the ability to execute keyboard shortcuts on the press of a button. There are quite a few very useful shortcuts which are common to all versions of Windows, and it would be nice to have simple one-click access to these.
grayhaze
Reply #23 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 4:34 AM
Reply #23 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 4:34 AM
My next task of course is to find a way of getting all these buttons on a titlebar without it appearing cluttered.
I've managed a maximum of around 12 titlebar buttons before things start to look unintuitive.
I've managed a maximum of around 12 titlebar buttons before things start to look unintuitive.
voo
Reply #24 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 7:13 AM
Reply #24 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 7:13 AM
erm, that could be quite bad from what i heard, more buttons on titlebar and the skin can become very slow.
Just something to think about here, or otherway you could do this is make buttons slide out, have a look at GreenReaper's Blackcomb grayhaze just to see *always ontop and roll up/down buttons* so it is not cluttered.
This you coming back to WindowBlinds again grayhaze?
Good to hear if you are.
Just something to think about here, or otherway you could do this is make buttons slide out, have a look at GreenReaper's Blackcomb grayhaze just to see *always ontop and roll up/down buttons* so it is not cluttered.
This you coming back to WindowBlinds again grayhaze?
Good to hear if you are.
dsn
Reply #25 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 8:16 AM
Reply #25 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 8:16 AM
Make a skin with 10 smartbuttons and let the user decide (pre-configuration allowed)...
eieio
Reply #26 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 9:59 AM
Reply #26 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 9:59 AM
I don't know how feasible this is but how about 1 button, call it a config button, that brings up a configuration dialog for the other buttons. To set the function of buttons 2,3,so on. That way the user could set the functions according to his/her own desires and be able to easily change those functions. I guess this would entail button 1 bringing up some sort of application to do this?
"the one they call ted" has some ObjectDock Icons that are for log off, shut down, etc. that are programmable in this fashion.
"the one they call ted" has some ObjectDock Icons that are for log off, shut down, etc. that are programmable in this fashion.
grayhaze
Reply #27 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 10:09 AM
Reply #27 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 10:09 AM
What you describe pictoratus is actually the whole idea behind SmartButtons, but the implementation of this feature is somewhat lacking. For example, it's entirely feasible to add ten SmartButtons as dsn suggests, but there are only four possible functions to tie to each of those buttons. Two of those four functions are already available as standard buttons anyway.
Until such time as the DLLs for SmartButtons are expanded and improved, the only option is to hard-code buttons. It's still possible to hide buttons until they're needed on an individual-window-basis using scripting. It's just not really possible as yet to offer customization options for those buttons without expecting the user to hand-edit the UIS file.
I'm still working on a solution to the 'launcher' button problem.
Until such time as the DLLs for SmartButtons are expanded and improved, the only option is to hard-code buttons. It's still possible to hide buttons until they're needed on an individual-window-basis using scripting. It's just not really possible as yet to offer customization options for those buttons without expecting the user to hand-edit the UIS file.
I'm still working on a solution to the 'launcher' button problem.
eieio
Reply #28 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 11:10 AM
Reply #28 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 11:10 AM
So, if I understand you, if someone came up with an app/interface that would edit the UIS file, button 1 could call up the app and, working with the existing Smart Button dlls available, the other buttons could be reprogrammed within that interface.
grayhaze
Reply #29 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 11:30 AM
Reply #29 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 11:30 AM
That app already exists - the WindowBlinds configuration dialog. If you look at the SmartButtons tab/section you'll see the options to configure the plugins used for the SmartButtons. The SmartButtons themselves will need to have been defined in the original skin, but once they are you have complete control over what they do and whether they are visible. It also doesn't touch the UIS file.
The problem lies in the plugins provided for SmartButtons. They are lacking in both number and implementation. For example, no matter how hard you try to define a button image for a URL shortcut, it still only displays as an ugly blue IE icon. The potential is there for a great plugin interface, but no development has been done to take advantage of the feature.
So for the time being, I'm steering away from using SmartButtons and just making sure everyone gets the features they want as default.
The problem lies in the plugins provided for SmartButtons. They are lacking in both number and implementation. For example, no matter how hard you try to define a button image for a URL shortcut, it still only displays as an ugly blue IE icon. The potential is there for a great plugin interface, but no development has been done to take advantage of the feature.
So for the time being, I'm steering away from using SmartButtons and just making sure everyone gets the features they want as default.
eieio
Reply #30 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 1:50 PM
Reply #30 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 1:50 PM
Ok, thanks. I keep learning more and more about this stuff. 
I'll have to look into Smart Buttons on the next skin I do.
I'll have to look into Smart Buttons on the next skin I do.
Sylva
Reply #31 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 2:05 PM
Reply #31 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 2:05 PM
dang it! I had it working last night before I went to bed. I changed something this morning (on another part of the skin) and after I re-saved it, it's not working. The code still looks the same though. That sucks. I'll keep working on it and see if I can fix it. If I can I'll let you know.
joetheblow
Reply #32 Thursday, May 8, 2003 2:24 AM
Reply #32 Thursday, May 8, 2003 2:24 AM
How come the button can't just link to it as a short cut? I know about the exe file only buttons, but I beleiev you can write a .wsd file and link it to the button show desktop.
Also, strangely enough, if you have a smartbutton and it is configured to go to the quicklaunch folder, guess what? The show desktop button is there as well (at least on my computer it was... win2000)
Also with win Menu, I believe you could set it to link to the show desktop button. But that would be 2 steps and not one...
Take a look at SETI (search for windowblinds under the name SETI) There are 2 of them. One in orange and one in green. Lots of buttons.
Funny you have this thread, thanks to SETI, am am inspired to make a skin with.... take a seat... 140 buttons!!!
(why 140? I don't know)
I have no idea how or what they will do but they are going to be in there.
winMenu
2 smartbuttons
roll up
always on top
always in front
attached to desktop
system drives
winamp 2
windows media player
display properties
specail folders (all of them)
and some others I can't think of right now
But to answer your question, how many is to many?
As long as the window is clean and useable, I think its cool. It can look really busy (check out some 2001 skins on wincuto) but I think it can look really good and simple if you want it that way.
haha that is my 2 cents.
Also, strangely enough, if you have a smartbutton and it is configured to go to the quicklaunch folder, guess what? The show desktop button is there as well (at least on my computer it was... win2000)
Also with win Menu, I believe you could set it to link to the show desktop button. But that would be 2 steps and not one...
Take a look at SETI (search for windowblinds under the name SETI) There are 2 of them. One in orange and one in green. Lots of buttons.
Funny you have this thread, thanks to SETI, am am inspired to make a skin with.... take a seat... 140 buttons!!!
(why 140? I don't know)
I have no idea how or what they will do but they are going to be in there.
winMenu
2 smartbuttons
roll up
always on top
always in front
attached to desktop
system drives
winamp 2
windows media player
display properties
specail folders (all of them)
and some others I can't think of right now
But to answer your question, how many is to many?
As long as the window is clean and useable, I think its cool. It can look really busy (check out some 2001 skins on wincuto) but I think it can look really good and simple if you want it that way.
haha that is my 2 cents.
joetheblow
Reply #33 Thursday, May 8, 2003 2:28 AM
Reply #33 Thursday, May 8, 2003 2:28 AM
Search for an
Extra
Tiny
Intereface
SETI. (I forgot who did it) Hope that helps you grayhaze
Extra
Tiny
Intereface
SETI. (I forgot who did it) Hope that helps you grayhaze
Sylva
Reply #34 Thursday, May 8, 2003 4:44 AM
Reply #34 Thursday, May 8, 2003 4:44 AM
DavidK did SETI for the GUI-O last year.
Still one of my favorites. *s*
Still one of my favorites. *s*
grayhaze
Reply #35 Thursday, May 8, 2003 4:52 AM
Reply #35 Thursday, May 8, 2003 4:52 AM
As I've said before, I don't consider SmartButtons to be worthwhile additions to a skin. The two useful buttons both have problems. The URL button can't be skinned, and the QuickLaunch button doesn't work correctly under WinXP. I've also had problems skinning the button for QuickLaunch under certain circumstances too.
SETI is certainly a very good skin, but I find the titlebar buttons a little too small for use at high resolutions, and often find myself accidentally clicking on a wrong button. I've still used the skin a lot though because I like the overall look, and the way it's put together.
I'm looking into scripting at the moment, but I don't believe it's currently possible to launch applications from a script.
SETI is certainly a very good skin, but I find the titlebar buttons a little too small for use at high resolutions, and often find myself accidentally clicking on a wrong button. I've still used the skin a lot though because I like the overall look, and the way it's put together.
I'm looking into scripting at the moment, but I don't believe it's currently possible to launch applications from a script.
Sylva
Reply #36 Thursday, May 8, 2003 7:55 AM
Reply #36 Thursday, May 8, 2003 7:55 AM
I got it working again. It seems I accidentally deleted the skin's derectory name from the file path. Want me to post the section of the code here so you can see it?
eieio
Reply #37 Thursday, May 8, 2003 11:08 AM
Reply #37 Thursday, May 8, 2003 11:08 AM
I'd like to see it, Sylva. I'm always looking for new things to add to my repertoire.
grayhaze
Reply #38 Thursday, May 8, 2003 1:16 PM
Reply #38 Thursday, May 8, 2003 1:16 PM
What do you have working Sylva? Show us what you've got.
By the way, I'm making progress on the 'My Documents' problem. I'll let you know when I've found a good way of doing it.
By the way, I'm making progress on the 'My Documents' problem. I'll let you know when I've found a good way of doing it.
Sylva
Reply #39 Thursday, May 8, 2003 1:22 PM
Reply #39 Thursday, May 8, 2003 1:22 PM
It's exactly what I had descirbed in one of my earlier posts. I had to add it in notepad though, instead of in SkinStudio. SS kept cutting out the file path when I saved it.
[Button3]
ButtonImage=Futility\tbb4.bmp
Action=5
Align=1
XCoord=87
YCoord=0
Visibility=22
Command=C:\Program Files\Object Desktop\WindowBlinds\Futility\Show Desktop.scf
[Button3]
ButtonImage=Futility\tbb4.bmp
Action=5
Align=1
XCoord=87
YCoord=0
Visibility=22
Command=C:\Program Files\Object Desktop\WindowBlinds\Futility\Show Desktop.scf
grayhaze
Reply #40 Thursday, May 8, 2003 1:34 PM
Reply #40 Thursday, May 8, 2003 1:34 PM
Well that's solved one problem! I think I was having a similar problem with the path being removed. Well done Sylva.
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Reply #21 Wednesday, May 7, 2003 2:04 AM